A Wild Knifecat Appears! (Rengar Discussion)

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THUNDERMINE

Member

08-23-2013

I think he went the suicide route because none of us liked his rework ideas.


A small price to pay to keep Rengar viable.


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DontChangeRengar

Junior Member

08-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by FurryKittenSoup View Post
Ult only has 5-20 second cooldown. Only stealths for 1-2 seconds. Only grants 2 ferocity.

This allows him to keep his playstyle. Meaning you can jump into a fight. Fight, leave fight, ult then jump back in.

The low stealth time means he cannot just walk into lane and instantly kill before being seen. And requires better timing because it has a shorter window.

Because of the low cooldown on his ult, it allows him to keep his current teamfighting playstyle, while buffing it.

Meaning, everything else on rengar can remain unchanged.

Edit: Actually, I take that back.Jungle Rengar needs some buffs. But I guess it's a little hard to buff his jungle without making his top lane too strong.
This wouldn't work, Your only halving the cooldown while cutting the duration into an 8th, all that is doing is nerfing the ult

Though you've given me something to think about now.

Keep up the good thinking!


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MobiIe Ward

Senior Member

08-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by DontChangeRengar View Post
This wouldn't work, Your only halving the cooldown while cutting the duration into an 8th, all that is doing is nerfing the ult

Though you've given me something to think about now.

Keep up the good thinking!
No.... if the cooldown is only like 5 or 10 seconds you can use it multiple times in a team fight. Ideally I'd like the ult at 5 second cooldown for teamfights. But that would be abusive in top lane. So i said 5-20 seconds for balancing. 20 at the most. So that's not a nerf. On live you don't even need the full duration except for the 5 ferocity if you are starting with 0 or for the movement speed to catch targets who get away from you.

And I came up with a good idea just now to make this viable for top lane.

Ult will normally have a longer cooldown duration. But stacks on the BTN will reduce the cooldown of the ult.

Don't know why you would say this is a nerf. It actually makes him stronger, giving him more options and takes away his toxicity at the same time.


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SquirrelEnFeu

Junior Member

08-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by FurryKittenSoup View Post
Ult only has 5-20 second cooldown. Only stealths for 1-2 seconds. Only grants 2 ferocity.

This allows him to keep his playstyle. Meaning you can jump into a fight. Fight, leave fight, ult then jump back in.

The low stealth time means he cannot just walk into lane and instantly kill before being seen. And requires better timing because it has a shorter window.

Because of the low cooldown on his ult, it allows him to keep his current teamfighting playstyle, while buffing it.

Meaning, everything else on rengar can remain unchanged.

Edit: To prevent this very short ult duration from being abusive in top lane, Ult will normally have a longer duration. But stacks on the BTN will reduce the cooldown of the ult.
It would be to easy to abuse as a top laner manaless. U could easily use it to win every trade by disengaging after the burst of his spell. U just have to play safe when ur ult is on couldown and rengar with is heal/ad reduction + bola will be a safepick. Can still hit cs from a certain range and sustain himself. After u win some trade, u just have to use ur ult as a big stealhts close gap to get the kill.

***Sry for my english, this is not my first langage.


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MobiIe Ward

Senior Member

08-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquirrelEnFeu View Post
It would be to easy to abuse as a top laner manaless. U could easily use it to win every trade by disengaging after the burst of his spell. U just have to play safe when ur ult is on couldown and rengar with is heal/ad reduction + bola will be a safepick. Can still hit cs from a certain range and sustain himself. After u win some trade, u just have to use ur ult as a big stealhts close gap to get the kill.

***Sry for my english, this is not my first langage.
Read the edit. During the laning phase it won't have a short cooldown. You need to get alot of BTN stacks to get the low cooldown ult.


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DontChangeRengar

Junior Member

08-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by FurryKittenSoup View Post
No.... if the cooldown is only like 5 or 10 seconds you can use it multiple times in a team fight. Ideally I'd like the ult at 5 second cooldown for teamfights. But that would be abusive in top lane. So i said 5-20 seconds for balancing. 20 at the most. So that's not a nerf. On live you don't even need the full duration except for the 5 ferocity if you are starting with 0 or for the movement speed to catch targets who get away from you.

And I came up with a good idea just now to make this viable for top lane.

Ult will normally have a longer duration. But stacks on the BTN will reduce the cooldown of the ult.

Don't know why you would say this is a nerf. It actually makes him stronger, giving him more options and takes away his toxicity at the same time.

I misunderstood the way you explained the timing, I shall have to get back to you on it, seems a bit... iffy and like khazix


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Okamiden

Junior Member

08-24-2013

What if Rengar only gains stealth when he enters bushes while ulted? He could gain stealth equal to his ult duration while ulted in brush, and retain stealth for 3-5 seconds after leaving brush. Rengar players wouldn't be able to press R and escape like before, making escaping ganks top harder. It'd give him that hunter feel we all love while giving him a sense of positioning and skill when used correctly with brush. Ganking would require a lot more skill and collaboration to take advantage of those 3(?) seconds, and pink wards wouldn't totally be needed to counter him either as Rengar would still enter the brush detected. I figure they could add Bonetooth upgrades to compliment this ult mechanic fittingly and tweak a few things.
I've seen someone else post this idea here, I just believe it needs more credit. I feel this idea fixes the overwhelming stealth mechanic while retaining it at the same time. It also means Rengar players can't stalk the squishy adc without a little more thought. (Also, imagine traversing the jungle with the speed boosts/temp stealth. Beastly stalking knifecat pouncing bush to bush just sounds so great.)


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Entheos Geon

Senior Member

08-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiyn View Post
Pff "all defintions into account" you say?


Vtr To pursue by tracking stealthily: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/stalk


SIT DOWN SIR.
Again, you don't need to be invisible to be stealthy.. so there goes your argument.

Seriously, most of you are opposing change just because you're used to the way things are and that's not a proper excuse to not change something. If everyone had that mindset, there would be no progress in the world.

At least have some faith in the devs to at least let their ideas hatch before you criticize them.


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Ashy Carry

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Senior Member

08-24-2013

Nobody wants his stealth removed!!! Listen to your fanbase RIOT!!


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DeathBySky

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Senior Member

08-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by LethalLingerie View Post
Nobody wants his stealth removed!!! Listen to your fanbase RIOT!!
Read main post edits. Scar has realized that stealth will most likely be needed to satisfy the player-base, yet he's still testing a no-stealth approach to see if he cold make it work. NOTHING is final.