In regards to Zilean

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Scraggleballs

Senior Member

11-14-2010

My last few games have been with Zilean. He's a fun champion to play and I just had a question or two about him. First one being, I know he isn't a carry but is it common to have a negative k/d ratio? I know ideally I'm sure it isn't but he feels like a better support champ than nuker/killer. Maybe its the way I've been playing him. There have only been a few games where I have a positive k/d.

I go meki + 2 health pots -> Chalice -> RoA -> Soul Shroud -> Innervating locket and the rest depends on what I need most be it AoE buffs/HP/whatever. Most of the time I get a RoA. If I don't have enough gold to purchase it by the 20m mark I avoid it usually. This usually nets me some pretty pathetic AP. It seems though that AP shouldn't be my focus. Am I mistaken? I've tried stacking AP and it seems pretty good during the laning phase when you have rank 4-5 time bombs, but seems to lose its usefulness towards the late game.


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Teucer753

Member

11-14-2010

You can usually get a few kills early on as your double bomb deals a lot of damage at low levels, but your damage output is too low mid-late game to do much other than chip people. He's support, and a negative K/D is hardly the worst thing in the world as long as you're not feeding hard.

As for builds, most people go heavy cooldown reduction, but might build a catalyst/RoA first. I generally start dorans ring and a healthpot personally. After the soulshroud you can look into a Glacial Shroud/Frozen heart to max your CDR or stick with the innervating locket if you'd prefer. AP builds are pretty fun though if you're team is doing well and you can get away with it.


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JustKitting

Senior Member

11-14-2010

I believe you have stumbled into the main problem with zilean. He has great power early on but late game he is rather lacking. I can tell you that in the beggining you are powerful and should take full advantage of it while you can because it will be short lived.

Instead of going towards an ap build in the beggining i like to start with a mana crystal get the hp pots and get mid if possible. You want to kill a champion at lvl 6 because that is around the easiest time to do it(take advantage of your second life). After farming a few champs get yourself a tear for the mana. After you have gotten a tear try and build cd reduction as fast as possible. If you can manage to get 40% cd reduction by mid game you are now god. You will want to get the golem buff so you can keep up a constant movespeed buff and slow when needed and the ability to revive any champs that die every 30 seconds or so. after which point simply build as a support. this usually is the best way to help your team overall.

p.s. get to 18 as fast as possible at 18 you can keep a team pushing indefinitely if they are smart.


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xpsychedelico

Senior Member

11-14-2010

Something to note, with good CDR and spamming W, you can use your ult twice in 30s in a teamfight, so it's as good as having two carries. You might want to gear up for CDR and AP and see how it works out for you.


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SomniumProxy

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Senior Member

11-14-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by xpsychedelico View Post
Something to note, with good CDR and spamming W, you can use your ult twice in 30s in a teamfight, so it's as good as having two carries. You might want to gear up for CDR and AP and see how it works out for you.

Exactly what I was going to say.

While AP Zil is popular, I always prefer CDR Zil. He has insane utility and can be completely frusterating to deal with when you're playing against him. You can toss in some AP items, but your main focus should be CDR. You can use Death Fire Grasp for the extra nuke and CDR, as well as archanagels due to your frequent spell use.

Your build is not bad tho, so I'm just tossing ideas. One thing you should know about support champions is that they generally have the largest spectrum of possible builds, so you really get to make many choices. If you make the good ones depending on the game, you'll be able to adapt perfectly and totally dominate :P


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Wonton55

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Senior Member

11-14-2010

Yup, CDR is the way to go. Only problem is, you need to build up some serious mana regen throughout the game. A high-level Zilean with 40% CDR can burn 120 + 50 + 100 mana every 3.6 seconds, which equates to 75 mana per second. The worst thing that can happen to you is being out of mana just as a nearby teammate is dying, and being unable to ult them. It's also bad to have to b every couple of minutes, because then your teammates can't trust you to be there to support their push/defense/gank/dragon.

P.S. Try and get a 1v2 lane if you have a jungler. Assuming you can survive to about level 5, you can start dishing out CRAZY amounts of damage to your low-level enemies with double bombing.


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Panzerfaust

Emissary of the League

11-14-2010

I've never really gotten effective with Zilean, but he is a fun champ. I'll second that mid-late game his damage drops, unless you've gotten extremely fed early game (which you should not be hoping for, since it's unlikely). Playing against Zilean's I think what I've found most annoying is those that can stay at the back of the team fight, keeping up the move speed buff/debuff, and throwing bombs out when safe to do so (keep in mind you can bomb your allies so you don't have to get all of the way in range).

That said, my little nitpick, where does the idea of 1 kill / 2 deaths being a negative ratio come from? Unless it's negative exponents (which seems silly, but you never know) it wouldn't just be a ratio of less than 1? >.>