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Why this game isn't viral

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Razerwind

Senior Member

12-09-2009

Nobody knows what viral means nowadays.

BTW TF2 has as high of a learning curve as LoL oddly enough.


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Autern

Senior Member

12-09-2009

Quote:
Razerwind:
Nobody knows what viral means nowadays.

BTW TF2 has as high of a learning curve was LoL oddly enough.


Pretty much. Though you could just go Pyro or Demo and spam.


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Vantasia

Member

12-09-2009

What happened to playing for fun? Btw you don't have to win to have fun.

This game doesn't have a big learning curve either... just give your mates some time...


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Razerwind

Senior Member

12-09-2009

Quote:
Autern:
Pretty much. Though you could just go Pyro or Demo and spam.


That won't work versus anybody but first-time players. Demo and pyro are both hard to master. Once you master demoman you bring the best utility to the game though.


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synack

Senior Member

12-09-2009

Quote:
Vantasia:
What happened to playing for fun? Btw you don't have to win to have fun.

This game doesn't have a big learning curve either... just give your mates some time...

Because playing and losing over and over again is ... fun?


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Crunx

Senior Member

12-09-2009

OP, what you described will happen in any competitive online multiplayer game. LoL isnt unique. Heck I would go so far as to say LoL is even easier to learn because at low levels the recommended item build will be fine, where as not knowing a map or gun spawns in just about any FPS spells certain doom for your team.


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Labomba

Senior Member

12-09-2009

I see alot of QQ over this, but this isn't some long term problem. Here are your options:

1) Play practice games with your friends to get them up to speed on the game. If they are good gamers, it does not take long to figure out everything out, and after a week of playing practice games, they should be ready and you can do some normal games. Unless you are a top-tier player, it's not difficult to still compete in the mid-tier ELO.

2) If your friends are just awful at this game and can't seem to improve, but you want to play normal games with them, create a new account. And when you can't play, have your friends also try some solo matches. If they are getting crushed on noob island, then once again you wouldn't want them playing normal games with you.

3) If they are so bad that they are losing even low ELO matches with you playing on a new account, then stick to practice games.


I'm not sure why this is so hard for people to figure out? "Oh my friends can't compete with my current ELO bracket QQ, QQ, QQ". No one cares. There are practice games to play if you really want to play with them. No one is going to cater to your friends being horrible or new. And this happens with EVERY game, not just LoL. Be thankful that LoL has a practice option so there's nothing to risk.


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12-09-2009

Quote:
Labomba:
I'm not sure why this is so hard for people to figure out? "Oh my friends can't compete with my current ELO bracket QQ, QQ, QQ". No one cares. There are practice games to play if you really want to play with them. No one is going to cater to your friends being horrible or new. And this happens with EVERY game, not just LoL. Be thankful that LoL has a practice option so there's nothing to risk.


Why do you have an attitude that "It's fine, deal with it", when there are potentially ways this could be alleviated? Why are you so satisfied with the status quo?

So, here's the problem in a nutshell:

  • Riot decided that they wanted to prevent players from using smurf accounts to get a team of good players matched up against a team of mediocre players. The idea would be that a team of 5 top-tier players would have 2-3 of them create brand new accounts, so that instead of playing at top-tier they would be lowered down to mid-tier.

  • Therefore, when a team with a wide-range of Elos gets teamed up, the system will match opponents closer to the highest Elo player. The good news is that this prevents the exploitation I mentioned above. The bad news is that it completely screws over groups of friends that are varied in skill.

So, take a player like myself. I'm pretty hardcore about this game. I usually play for at least a few hours a night. I don't think I'm a top-500 player, but I've faced top-500 players before and held my own. I hit level-30 around the time the store came out, and currently have all the champions unlocked and enough runes to make pages for pretty much any character I want to play.

I have several friends who play this game, but none as hardcore as me. One of them just hit 30 the other day, but most of them are around the level 20 range. When they solo-queue, they usually do VERY well. When they group with me, often they'll go fairly negative because we get matched up against another premade who is more organized and more experienced.

Practice games aren't always an option. Completely putting aside the fact that the rewards are reduced, it's also very difficult for a 5-man premade to find opponents. Additionally, even if we do find opponents, usually the games aren't very evenly matched (Stomping a pug of noobs isn't a good alternative to being stomped).

So, the real problem isn't the fact that the matchmaking system is UNABLE to find a suitable match for a group of players like this, but the fact that it refuses to in order to prevent exploitation.

However, this problem is not without a solution:

  • Systems such as true-skill have a "Certainty" value attached to the player's skill. Therefore, the system can detect when a player is new as it is "Uncertain" of their skill level. Someone who's at a low-mid Elo with 100 games played would have a fairly certain skill level though.

  • If Riot attached a similar value to our skills, the system could have an easier time detecting smurfs vs lower-skilled players. This way, a group of players such as my friends and me would be matched up against evenly-matched opponents without concern, and high-elo smurfers would still be prevented from exploiting.


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Logo

Senior Member

12-09-2009

Quote:

  • Systems such as true-skill have a "Certainty" value attached to the player's skill. Therefore, the system can detect when a player is new as it is "Uncertain" of their skill level. Someone who's at a low-mid Elo with 100 games played would have a fairly certain skill level though.

  • If Riot attached a similar value to our skills, the system could have an easier time detecting smurfs vs lower-skilled players. This way, a group of players such as my friends and me would be matched up against evenly-matched opponents without concern, and high-elo smurfers would still be prevented from exploiting.
I liked your post up until I read this and now I hate it and as an extension you (kidding... sorta). TruSkill is a terrible system precisely because of this certainty rating.

I don't know if anything can really be done. The only way to fairly make a match would be to match a bunch of low ranked players + a high ranked player vs your premade. That wouldn't really be fair to the high ranked player who wants to have decent opponents not newbies.


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12-09-2009

Quote:
Logo:
[/list]I liked your post up until I read this and now I hate it and as an extension you (kidding... sorta). TruSkill is a terrible system precisely because of this certainty rating.

I don't know if anything can really be done. The only way to fairly make a match would be to match a bunch of low ranked players + a high ranked player vs your premade. That wouldn't really be fair to the high ranked player who wants to have decent opponents not newbies.

If my guess is correct as to WHY you hate the certainty system, then I actually agree with you.

My beef with the TruSkill Certainty system is that once you reach a point it prevents you from progressing upwards in the ladder even if your skill increases. This is because that "certainty" is applied not only to your matchmaking, but also to your skill progression.

My suggestion was merely to use this value in this one instance, to prevent smurfing while still allowing wide-skill-gapped players to be put in good matches.

If I was incorrect in my assessment of your dislike for TruSkill let me know. I'm curious as to what flaw you see with my suggestion.