### Welcome to the Forum Archive!

Years of conversation fill a ton of digital pages, and we've kept all of it accessible to browse or copy over. Whether you're looking for reveal articles for older champions, or the first time that Rammus rolled into an "OK" thread, or anything in between, you can find it here. When you're finished, check out the boards to join in the latest League of Legends discussions.

### Frequently Asked Questions or Mechanics

Dangazzm

Junior Member

Great post, and information bookmarked and going to use this for future reference thats for sure... helped this noob get started for sure!

Thanks again for taking the time to make this!

MoreExplosions

Junior Member

Quote:
Stumpster:
Q: What order is armor penetration/MR penetration applied in? (Credit to TiberiusAudley)

A: From top to bottom

Armor/MR Reduction
% Based Armor/MR Penetration
Flat/Linear Armor/MR Penetration

Trying to clarify things here with a base example of someone with 185 armor.

185 - 85 (The Black Cleaver + Stark's Fervor) = 100
100 - 40 (Last Whisper) = 60
60 - 40 (25 armor penetration from runes and The Brutalizer) = 20

Is that roughly how it works? If so, I'm thinking that you can skip The Black Cleaver and Stark's Fervor entirely unless you specifically need Stark's aura.

185 - 74 (Last Whisper) = 111
111 - 40 (25 armor penetration from runes and The Brutalizer) = 71

Not bad considering you saved over 5k gold for a difference of 51 armor. Instead, you can use that money to get something like Infinity Edge and/or The Bloodthirster. Also, can armor penetration bring someone into the negatives or does it stop applying after 0 armor?

Stumpster

That's actually a good question, the only thing that can bring people into negative armor is straight Armor/MR Reduction (obviously, this is rare as it is always applied first). Armor Penetration, as far as I know, stops having any affect after 0 armor.

PineappleThis

Senior Member

I have a couple questions I want to clarify.

Stacking of same items that are not unique add on top of each other 100%?
For example, Black Cleaver reduces armor by 12 each attack, with 2 Black Cleavers
would each hit reduce armor by 24?

2x Guinsoo's Rageblade (which I almost never see used in game)
would stack each attack to add 8% attack speed and 16 ability power.

And the one I'm most curious about cause it seems
quite the most powerful, is stacking Madred's Bloodrazor, because most
small % high effect items like that are unique. And when it says
"deals magic damage equal to 2.5% of targets Maximum Health" I'm wondering
does that mean their literal maximum health or their current health?

Does Malady stack the bonus damage cumulatively?
Like 5+10+15+...+30 then each hit after that would add 30 bonus damage?

Does Tiamat's splash work on ranged, assuming it does, is it less
effective on ranged? And do you know the % of damage it splash (melee and ranged), I'm
assuming it would not splash 100% of your damage. (Another item
hardly seen)

Thanks for your time, mostly just speculating things that I think of when I play, I don't necessarily use
these items all that often.

Stumpster

- Stacking of items that are not unique do stack 100%, which means all of your examples are exactly correct.

- Madred's Bloodrazor is based off of the maximum health, not their current health.

- That is exactly how Malady works. If you have it and deal 100 damage normally, then with Malady you would have:

100
105
110
115
120
125
130
130
130
ect.

- Tiamat splash works just as well on ranged characters as melee, and the percentage is approx. 35%

Stumpster

After further testing, the Black Cleaver debuff doesn't appear to stack, which means the only thing getting two BC's does is help you get to the 5x stack faster! Other potentially stackable buffs from items (Guinsoo's Rageblade) probably work the same way, however stackable effects (Madred's Bloodrazer) definitely work together.

Pinith

Senior Member

One thing that I think you should fix. You correctly state that armor/MR is <not> subject to diminishing returns, because each point adds the same amount of survivability.

You dodge section, however, states that dodge is subject to diminishing returns. Your example (20% on top of an effective 19.9%) is actually consistent with the armor/MR model. 19.9% reduction means if you would have gotten hit 1000 times, you now get hit 801 times. 20% more dodge lowers this to 640.8 hits taken, which is a total of 35.92% dodge. Because you are still dodging 20% of the attacks that would have otherwise hit, there aren't really diminishing returns.

edit:
I've only used Malady a couple times, but it seems like you get the first 5 damage immediately, so in the example two posts up it would be
105
110
etc.

Flinck

Junior Member

Does Wits End mana remove and dmg done based on mana removed stack with kassadin's passive ability?

Ksielvin

Senior Member

Quote:
Stumpster:

Q: What are these diminishing movement returns? (Credit to Guinsoo)

A: For each point of movement you would have above 490, that amount is reduced by 50%. So if your final movement speed was 748, it would be reduced to 490 + (748-490)*0.5 = 604. For each point of movement you would have above 415, it is reduced by 20%. So if your speed after all mods was 445, you would end with 415 + 30 * 0.8 = 439.

Quote:
Stumpster:

@ Movement

They actually just changed the diminishing returns last patch, so I need to fix that anyways.

But to answer the question, I think that both movement caps are calculated and that example just doesn't show it.

I thought this was a little unclear so I went and tested it. Result is that both movement caps are calculated, with 50% reduction kicking in for the portion over 490. The explanation in FAQ currently almost looks like two different explanations.

Master Yi, Boots of Swiftness: 419 (20% reduction kicking in at 415)
Master Yi, Boots of Swiftness, Phantom Dancer: 459 (as expected)
Master Yi, Boots of Swiftness, 2 Phantom Dancers: 490

The final value does appear to come from ((330+90)*1.24-490)*0.5+(490-415)*0.8+415 = 490.

Riot aBhorsen

Recruiter

Am i calculating correctly here:

If i have 3431HP and i have:

Deathfire Grasp 35 Magic Resist
Banshee's Vail 60 Magic Resist
Lich Bane 32 Magic Resist

That would be total 127 Magic Resist which would mean it would take 3431 * 127% = 4288 + 3431 Spell damage to kill me?

Surely that is wrong, it seems ridiculously high