So, about that Karma leak...

First Riot Post
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relevantex

Senior Member

03-12-2013

This whole thread is an argument going nowhere because it's split between people with completely different view points: those who used to love Karma, and those who saw her as another champion. I've read through this thread, wading through all the tears, and at page 100+ or so it's purely an EMOTIONAL plea to Riot. They have this bond to a champion that they fell in love with, like a character in a story. That's why her dress, her fans, her walk, etc. are the most important aspects to them because they convey who Karma was as a character in their mind - an elegant beauty who fought out of necessity rather than just to prove her strength like so many other champions.That's why there's all this backlash calling her generic and a sIut, etc. Do they really think she looks like a sIut? Probably not, but it's just an emotional response from a group of people who are upset about their character being 'taken away' essentially.

None of that emotional stuff matters to the people who saw her as a champion. To them, the changes make complete sense. Her main theme was always inner strength, and Riot decided to take that one theme and go wild with it instead keeping her hodgepodge of themes intact. This makes perfect LOGICAL sense to the people who just saw her as a champion, including Riot themselves. That's why Morello can sit back and crack fan jokes all day: he has no emotional attachment to Karma - she's another champion, an outdated project, that needed reworking. They don't get what the huge deal is about the fans, dress, and walk - they're just obsolete components.To them now the champion finally reflects a proper theme and the kit will (hopefully) follow suit.

These are the two arguments being made that can't see eye to eye. They come from two different sides that see Karma completely differently, but the only way to appease both is to see the argument from both sides. What's truly hilarious is the solution is quite simple: in order to appease both groups let the Traditional skin have the fans and walk from old Karma while the new Karma remains the default. That's it. Both groups get to have "their" Karma in the respective skins so no one really loses out. The kit can continue to be updated and hardly anyone would have any issues with it.


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MrTharne

Senior Member

03-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by relevantex View Post
What's truly hilarious is the solution is quite simple: in order to appease both groups let the Traditional skin have the fans and walk from old Karma while the new Karma remains the default. That's it. Both groups get to have "their" Karma in the respective skins so no one really loses out. The kit can continue to be updated and hardly anyone would have any issues with it.
While i agree with the other parts of your post, there is a problem here.
If the Traditional skin has the walk from old Karma without a dress, that would just look silly, BUT if you give her the dress and the fans, you have to adapt the rest of the new animations and spells, so Riot basically give a free "Legendary" Skin to anyone who has Karma ? I don't think they want that.


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Healurownbum

Senior Member

03-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by relevantex View Post
This whole thread is an argument going nowhere because it's split between people with completely different view points: those who used to live Karma, and those who saw her as another champion. I've read through this thread, wading through all the tears, and at page 100+ or so it's purely an EMOTIONAL plea to Riot. They have this bond to a champion that they fell in love with, like a character in a story. That's why her dress, her fans, her walk, etc. are the most important aspects to them because they convey who Karma was as a character in their mind - an elegant beauty who fought out of necessity rather than just to prove her strength like so many other champions.That's why there's all this backlash calling her generic and a sIut, etc. Do they really think she looks like a sIut? Probably not, but it's just an emotional response from a group of people who are upset about their character being 'taken away' essentially.

None of that emotional stuff matters to the people who saw her as a champion. To them, the changes make complete sense. Her main theme was always inner strength, and Riot decided to take that one theme and go wild with it instead keeping her hodgepodge of themes intact. This makes perfect LOGICAL sense to the people who just saw her as a champion, including Riot themselves. That's why Morello can sit back and crack fan jokes all day: he has no emotional attachment to Karma - she's another champion, an outdated project, that needed reworking. They don't get what the huge deal is about the fans, dress, and walk - they're just obsolete components.To them now the champion finally reflects a proper theme and the kit will (hopefully) follow suit.

These are the two arguments being made that can't see eye to eye. They come from two different sides that see Karma completely differently, but the only way to appease both is to see the argument from both sides. What's truly hilarious is the solution is quite simple: in order to appease both groups let the Traditional skin have the fans and walk from old Karma while the new Karma remains the default. That's it. Both groups get to have "their" Karma in the respective skins so no one really loses out. The kit can continue to be updated and hardly anyone would have any issues with it.
Well worded. But i dont think she looks like a ****. They had to *** her up and im fine with that *** sells. Its the fact for me she went for this delicated, fragile flower. To in my eyes someone who would be able to beat anyone up. She has the looks of a fighter. Alot more muscle. Too me there isnt anything left of old Karma. Expect a skin.

Just that if what rly bugs me. Going from a wallflower to a frontline fighter. Its a too big of a change.

Edit* Hope i got my point over correctly god knows im a moron with words lol. Why can you say **** but i cant?!


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Severian NA

Senior Member

03-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by relevantex View Post
This whole thread is an argument going nowhere because it's split between people with completely different view points: those who used to live Karma, and those who saw her as another champion. I've read through this thread, wading through all the tears, and at page 100+ or so it's purely an EMOTIONAL plea to Riot. They have this bond to a champion that they fell in love with, like a character in a story. That's why her dress, her fans, her walk, etc. are the most important aspects to them because they convey who Karma was as a character in their mind - an elegant beauty who fought out of necessity rather than just to prove her strength like so many other champions.That's why there's all this backlash calling her generic and a sIut, etc. Do they really think she looks like a sIut? Probably not, but it's just an emotional response from a group of people who are upset about their character being 'taken away' essentially.

None of that emotional stuff matters to the people who saw her as a champion. To them, the changes make complete sense. Her main theme was always inner strength, and Riot decided to take that one theme and go wild with it instead keeping her hodgepodge of themes intact. This makes perfect LOGICAL sense to the people who just saw her as a champion, including Riot themselves. That's why Morello can sit back and crack fan jokes all day: he has no emotional attachment to Karma - she's another champion, an outdated project, that needed reworking. They don't get what the huge deal is about the fans, dress, and walk - they're just obsolete components.To them now the champion finally reflects a proper theme and the kit will (hopefully) follow suit.

These are the two arguments being made that can't see eye to eye. They come from two different sides that see Karma completely differently, but the only way to appease both is to see the argument from both sides. What's truly hilarious is the solution is quite simple: in order to appease both groups let the Traditional skin have the fans and walk from old Karma while the new Karma remains the default. That's it. Both groups get to have "their" Karma in the respective skins so no one really loses out. The kit can continue to be updated and hardly anyone would have any issues with it.
T.T
What I've been saying all along. I get that Riot made this decision, although I hope they didn't decide to do so lightly. Making this about how (and I still don't) I can't quite see why they would make such radical changes, and how they should reconsider, is not going to go anywhere. That is and has been my take on this.
I just wanted to understand, be understood, and to see if there was any way of preventing Karma from being completely erased and redone.


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Severian NA

Senior Member

03-12-2013

...I'd pay legendary price to keep her. Just saying.

Edit: Whaat? Does it sound that desperate? XD


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Afrocalypse

Senior Member

03-12-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTharne View Post
While i agree with the other parts of your post, there is a problem here.
If the Traditional skin has the walk from old Karma without a dress, that would just look silly, BUT if you give her the dress and the fans, you have to adapt the rest of the new animations and spells, so Riot basically give a free "Legendary" Skin to anyone who has Karma ? I don't think they want that.
Welp, I don't know. Wearing a dress like that doesn't instantly force you to walk like that, I'd say. An elegant way of walking is an elegant way of walking, I myself can see that working with her new outfit as well. Also those tunes you described don't really make it legendary for todays standards.


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Terra Enigma

Senior Member

03-12-2013

Guinsoooooooooooo?!!?!?!?!?!?


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Josh de Tonreau

Senior Member

03-12-2013

Just make karma a legacy champ
I don't want rude VU-tagalongs playing her


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Zero

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Senior Member

03-12-2013

From someone who plays Karma occasionally in every season (even still, just finished one with her mid), I will definitely miss the fans, the dress, the animations, and everything that Karma was that defined her. That being said, the changes she'll be getting will (or rather, should) improve her as a champion and it's not so much HER I loved, but her playstyle. It's why I continue to play her. Not because she has a full dress and walks funky because of it. If the visual looks are what drives you, I'm sure you can band together and figure a way to incorporate the old skin in with the new spells. There are other custom "skins" for use for other champions. Whether or not you're allowed to use them I don't know, but if the old look is that important then there are ways to use it. I for one will enjoy playing new Karma.


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Kerou

Senior Member

03-12-2013

Thank you for doing this riot. Ever since I started Karma was a champion I wanted but people always said not to get because she was horrible. Now I can play my favorite champion without getting yelled at