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[Rework] Sivir the Blade Mistress

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3mptylord

Senior Member

02-25-2013

Just because they are supporty doesn't mean they are good.


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The5lacker

Senior Member

02-26-2013

Quote:
3mptylord:
If we're including champions that grant AD, then yes, Taric, Sona, Gangplank and Janna too (and probably others). But I was referring to damage modifiers specifically (i.e. Lacerate, Pix and ... whatever Nami's is called, Tidecaller's Blessing?).

"Hey, bruisers! Get in there with your tankiness and take my AD buff!" is exactly what I was aiming for - but in designed the kit to be more of a captain/commander. The point is they only get damage from Sivir if she has damage to give - and I think there's only one AD-support item. Sivir and her team benefit from Sivir building as a carry. Double ADC kill lanes would work, I don't deny it.

We aren't saying "Don't build AD." We're saying "Don't try and carry when you can support much better." It's like Gangplank: Sure, he's marked as a carry, but he just isn't. He's either a bruiser (a role new Sivir would handle nicely), or a support (a role new Sivir would handle GLORIOUSLY.) This new Sivir is a buffing machine, and wasting those buffs on your Mages and Tanks is, well, a waste. Having her support another AD carry? Having her drastically raise their damage output, rather than simply healing them when they do something stupid? We have an opportunity here for a startlingly effective new breed of support, and you're sitting here digging your heels in going "NO, SHE'S SUPPOSED TO CARRY A TEAM, SHE'S NOT SUPPOSED TO SUPPORT WITH HER BUFFS, NO!"

This Sivir design is more support than Gangplank, Zyra, and even most tanks. Having her bot lane with a Draven or Caitlyn would result in the enemy getting their asses handed to them, as Sivir blocks the enemy skillshot with her spell shield triggering rally and resulting in a hilarious backlash from her teammate as they proceed to mount the enemy's head on their wall from the damage buff and armor shredding. You being this closeminded and shortsighted about this completely boggles my mind. The fact that you didn't think that giving Sivir a bunch of teammate buffs wouldn't give her a more supportive role is completely incomprehensible. This Sivir would completely change the support metagame, and in a great way.


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3mptylord

Senior Member

04-01-2013

There a four prominent uses of the word "support":

  • Meta/Tactic - 0CS duo lane (when people say "I'm playing support Gragas", this is what they mean)
  • Official Definition - A champion who can heal or shield (champion attributes section)(Blitz isn't a support, for example)
  • Meta Definition - A champion who can enable (Blitz is a support, and Soraka is considered a poor support)
  • Build - Low cost items that are most cost efficient when near allies

She doesn't work with the current meta - she's too item dependent for her effects to work. She doesn't heal or shield. I personally don't think auras count as an enable - she cannot set-up fights, she just increases the damage dealt in them. She doesn't work with low cost "support items" because they don't grant the stats she wants/enough of them. Thus - I don't think she's a support. That's my opinion. Feel free to say I'm digging in my heels - but you said yourself that she would have to break the meta to work in a duo lane. So, basically, you agree with me - you just don't like how I'm saying it.

You said in your first response that the idea was overly complicated, destructive and pointless. Just then you said that she completely changes the meta in a great way and does it gloriously. Either you've changed your mind about my rework (but are arguing anyway), or you just like arguing.


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