Item Idea to Make Melee ADC Viable

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IamDuddits

Senior Member

02-23-2013

Stygian Monarch Staff (SMS):

Pickaxe: 875
Ruby Crystal: 475
Recipe: 1350
Total: 2700

+200 HP
+25 Damage

Active: Grants magic immunity. Duration and cooldown decrease with each use. Some Ultimate abilities are able to disable through Stygian Monarch Staff. Duration: 10/9/8/7/6/5. Cooldown: 80/75/70/65/60/55

An item like this would allow carries to survive long enough to deal damage in team fights without being completely and utterly dependent on their entire team to permastun the enemy Tanky DPS.

Any thoughts?


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Ericxz

Senior Member

02-23-2013

Yes you can buy this or you can buy a warmogs or any tanky items. I agree that this would be a good item on melee adc but what if the other team buys it too? You activate your immunity they activate theres. Then you do no damage in the end.The problem is the other team can buy this item and activate it the same time you do then you do no damage becuz of immunity.


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Galgus

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Senior Member

02-23-2013

Just CC immunity for 1 second would be enough, really.

Don't completely gimp Mages- they need time free of CC shutdown, not extra durability.

Just make Merc Scimitar a Crit/ AD item and add that for melee only.


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Ericxz

Senior Member

02-23-2013

I think riot should just buff melee carries in all.


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IamDuddits

Senior Member

02-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericxz View Post
Yes you can buy this or you can buy a warmogs or any tanky items. I agree that this would be a good item on melee adc but what if the other team buys it too? You activate your immunity they activate theres. Then you do no damage in the end.The problem is the other team can buy this item and activate it the same time you do then you do no damage becuz of immunity.
Magic Immunity in this case would mean anything from abilities. Right Clicks would still do damage. The idea behind it is so that they don't get stunlocked and bursted in 2 seconds.


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Beersmasher

Member

02-23-2013

You already have the black cleaver, what more could you want? Don't most melee AD have some kind of dash ability? This would just be another item that could be thrown on a tanky person to further the imbalance already present. IMO there should be very few items that offer HPS and ad/ap on the same item. If you want HPS you buy HPS but you have to leave behind the damage and vice versa.


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The Lord Impaler

Senior Member

02-24-2013

I was mentioning in this thread (beware long)

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...3154378&page=2

That the fundamental problem is that the core ADC item effects (Attack Damage, Life-steal, Attack-speed), have identical effects on melee and ranged champions. Thus it is impossible to balance a melle and ranged champion, ranged gets to attack first so they get more for their Attack Damage and Attack-speed, melee champions need to get into the thick of the enemy team meaning they take more damage and get less from life-steal.

Riot can do one of three things, 1) do across-the-board nerfs to these effects when Ranged, similar to how Spell-vamp is cut to 1/3 for AoE spells. 2) have a large number of items give lesser effects to ranged champs (like recent ice-born-gauntlets changes). or 3) permanently split off a number of superior items as melee only.


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67chrome

Senior Member

02-24-2013

10 seconds is completely broken, and entirely to long of a duration to deal with any burst caster. That would help out bruisers more than melee carries really - not to mention AD is something that's significantly less cost effective on most melee carries over more, seeing as they generally have solid base AD scaling and a rather powerful AD steroid. Such a Black King Bar item would offer no counter-play to champions that are reliant on CC and abilities as well - if you thought seeing quicksilver sash was disheartening to Malzahar players before this would completely invalidate not only Malz but just about all AP carries (Ahri is about the only actual mage that isn't CC reliant for escaping). 2700 gold is to cheap for that kind of power as well, and would likely result in a kill upon each activation, snowballing you hard enough each time to get another kill in a window of time 1 second shorter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lord Impaler View Post
Riot can do one of three things, 1) do across-the-board nerfs to these effects when Ranged, similar to how Spell-vamp is cut to 1/3 for AoE spells. 2) have a large number of items give lesser effects to ranged champs (like recent ice-born-gauntlets changes). or 3) permanently split off a number of superior items as melee only.
Or they could 4) give melee carries noticeably higher than average base attack speeds - which would effectively multiply all damage scalers and things like life steal on them better than the next guy, solving problems of cost-effectivness without getting to complicated concerning bruisers and ranged attack damage carries. It also makes plenty of sense - smacking something with a katana, cutlass, or rapier should be considerably swifter than operating a cannon, shotgun, or sniper rifle - or lamp post, great axe, or great sword. Turns out Maokai has better attack speed than Fiora, Trynd, Yi, or Gangplank though, and the difference in attack speed from ranged to melee weapons is essentially non-existent.


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The Lord Impaler

Senior Member

02-24-2013

Quote:
Or they could 4) give melee carries noticeably higher than average base attack speeds - which would effectively multiply all damage scalers and things like life steal on them better than the next guy, solving problems of cost-effectivness without getting to complicated concerning bruisers and ranged attack damage carries. It also makes plenty of sense - smacking something with a katana, cutlass, or rapier should be considerably swifter than operating a cannon, shotgun, or sniper rifle - or lamp post, great axe, or great sword. Turns out Maokai has better attack speed than Fiora, Trynd, Yi, or Gangplank though, and the difference in attack speed from ranged to melee weapons is essentially non-existent.
I think would make them strong early game rather then late game (any you need to be strong lake by definition to be a Carry), as everyone would still be increasing their attack-speed and damage with itemization at a similar rate so the ranged-melee DPS gap would become less and less significant. Melee ADC is not non-viable because of a lack of dangerous damage output once they are in fisticuffs with their opponent, it that Ranged ADC's can put out just as much if not more damage as them at range.


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ProfDrDeath

Senior Member

02-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galgus View Post
Just CC immunity for 1 second would be enough, really.

Don't completely gimp Mages- they need time free of CC shutdown, not extra durability.

Just make Merc Scimitar a Crit/ AD item and add that for melee only.
Wrong.

CC has less to do with Melee Carries not being viable than you think.

It is the fact that they, as a squishy glasscannon, voluntarily put themselves into melee (and therefore damage) range of the enemy team. And glass doesn't need a lot of damage to break...


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