ELO Hell EXISTS and possible solutions...

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ULTRON69

Junior Member

02-23-2013

First of all, let's get something straight: ELO HELL IS REAL (and inescapable under the current system)

Allow me to prove it beyond reasonable doubt.

We can all agree that TROLLS exist in LOL. They are of course most numerous in the lowest ELO echelons. Let's start with the worst trolls: AFK or Feeder trolls.

If you get stuck with one of these on your team the game is essentially 4v5 (possibly worse). Of course the odd 4v5 win does happen but this is quite flukey so let's ignore it for now.

I assert that even if you are the best player in the game, you will lose 4v5.

So, this type of loss has NOTHING to do with your skill level.

Although I don't have hard numbers to back me up (but they can be gotten), in the depths of ELO Hell there is ONE TROLL PER GAME on average.

Since Trolls are randomly distributed, your team has a 50% chance of getting the Troll.
Since getting the troll is an AUTOLOSS (on average) REGARDLESS of your skill level,
a player in ELO HELL can NEVER ESCAPE. Why? Because once you are in E.HELL, your exp win percentage becomes 50% as long as Trolls exist! In other words, TROLL >> Skill or, essentially, 4v5 >> Skill.

Is this not clear??? I really do not understand the debate on the EXISTENCE of E.Hell!!!

I'll be happy to debate elaborate on ELO Hell existence (if necessary), but let me move on to solutions.

Solution 1:

Dodge Rules need to vary ACCORDING TO ELO LEVELS. A player at lower elo need MUCH more ability to dodge than a higher elo player. Why? Because the lower level player needs to dodge Trolls (which can be spotted via LOLKING.COM). Higher level players don't need to worry about this. The current dodge rules only promulgate E.Hell.
If trolls can't get a game, they may give up and go away.

Solution 2:

Players should have to PAY RP's to PLAY RANKED GAMES. If you win, you get your RP's back. If you lose, you don't. Since TROLLS are autolosers, they would (presumably) run out of money and hence DISSAPPEAR from RANKED. But don't fret you TRolls, you can always troll normals for free.

Solution 3:

Riot should have in place some way to identify trolls based on raw numbers such as WIN %. By looking at enough data, it certainly can be determined what lowest win % separates merely BAD players from outright Trolls. After some stat significant number of games (say 50), if your win % is below the critical level you are AUTOBANNED. Im not talking 15-35 but more like 7-43....come on that has got to be a TROLL.

LET'S FIX THIS RIOT !!!!


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laxjoh

Senior Member

02-23-2013

I hope everyone who reads this will downvote you to oblivion. And you should elaborate why you think ELO hell exists. All your wordings will not make it proof that ELO hell exists. And it really doesn't exist. I suck and I climbed out of the low ELO in which you are in. I have not experienced the amount of trolls in my time at 800 elo climbing up to 1280 as people claim there to be.

Seriously, elaborate on why you think ELO hell exists. It will be funny seeing people try to prove its existence.

Also, solution #2 is the biggest fail I have ever heard. Also, solution #3 will never happen because Riot has said that they will not do that.

Another fail from your post. Trolls in low ranks are not as bad as trolls in higher ranks. You assume there are no trolls in diamond/plat/gold? You're dead wrong. There's MORE and WORSE trolls than in lower ELO. specifically because of two reasons; these trolls at higher ranks know they can simply climb right back up so they do it to piss someone off. Second reason, these players are significantly better than the trolls in bronze therefore they can make it look like they aren't trolling but actually are. Another reason why trolls are worse in higher ranks? Players will capitalize on mistakes/opportunities significantly better at higher ranking. Do you honestly think people in bronze can capitalize on enemy mistakes as well as people in platinum? So if there's a troll in platinum and a troll in bronze, the troll in platinum will do more damage in a single game.

You are so misinformed in just about the very little info you have given out that I seriously doubt anyone can take you seriously when you try to prove ELO hell exists.


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Enconex

Senior Member

02-23-2013

While I believe ELO hell does it exist for some players, there is a lot wrong with your post, DieTrollDie


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Fanaticmogg

Senior Member

02-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by DieTrollDie View Post
Since Trolls are randomly distributed, your team has a 50% chance of getting the Troll.
NO.

There are 4 players on your team and 5 on the other team. You have a 44.4% chance of getting a troll. The chances favour you.

That's assuming that you're not going to be the troll ever. If your stats are accurate, you're going to be the troll 10% of the time. If you're straight-up trying to lose 10% of your games, you can't complain about anything.

ADDENDUM: Even if you've got a 50/50 win chance based on which team the troll is on, you can still climb out if you're lucky. But you don't. Your skill has some effect on the chances of winning.


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NoooUncleAndross

Member

02-23-2013

Elo hell is where you end up when you don't focus on your own mistakes and make a concerted effort every game.

An easy set of mistakes to fix is failing to win cs in your lane. You miss cs, you could miss less. That is only the tip of the iceberg, there are countless things we can all improve on.


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angryWelchMan

Senior Member

02-23-2013

First of all there isn't one troll (afk or feeder) per game, at least not in my bronze level of play. Maybe its your behavior that is leading to your experiencing more trolls.

Second even if there is it isn't a definite loss, especially for the mild feeders. If you don't rage at them they give up on the feed at start helping out normally.

Third even assuming your entire premiss that every game has one troll who makes it impossible to win, as long as you never troll, your odds of victory are over 50% because you know at least one person on your team isn't a troll (so if your around 50% are you the troll)

Now on to your solution

Solution 1 is too easy to abuse because if you think their team has better players then your team (via lolking) you dodge for a smaller penalty.

Solution 2 will drastically decrease the number of people who play ranked. One of riots big selling points is that its fully free to play. You can play for free and not lose any function.

Solution 3 already exists its called tribunal. So maybe we do need harsher penalties given by the tribunal but you could shortened this whole post into that one sentence.

Now lets look at some real solutions to your recent losses

As nocturne (top lane) 42 minutes 136 cs 5/4/10 with one turret. Well your KDA is good but not really carry status and your cs is a little low and you didn't really push turrets(even though you had tp to splut push). So maybe you didn't hurt but you didnt really carry either

as mundo (jungle) 37 minutes 138 cs 1/7/10 with no turrets. Your KDA is barely positive, normally alright for a loss but you kind of want the jungle more involved then that. Good cs for a jungler but again no tower pushed. This one your not really a drain but dont deserve to win either.

as darius (top) 29 minutes 142 cs 0/3/0 with no turrets. Your kda is bad your cs a little low and again you didn't push or get involved with your teleport. Definitely deserved to lose.

as vayne (adc) 32 minutes 110 cs 7/7/2 with no turrets. your kda is alright if you were focused down hard in the fight but that CS is horrid. Again not really carry status when you in one of the easiest roles to carry from. no turret and low cs mean you didn't even win your lane. so you kind of deserve this loss

as nocturn (Jungle) 30 minutes 126 cs 3/7/3 and no turrets. your kda is bad your cs is pretty good for a jungler but didnt push any towers (recognizing a theme) definitely deserved to lose.

as cait (adc) 36 minutes 177 cs 4/4/5 and two turrets. Your kda isn't great but ok considering you lost and were probably focused actually decent cs and you were able to push towers. Your build is a little of (got tier three boots too early and probably should have gotten homeguard) but this is a deserved win I'd say

so out of you last 6 losses you got robbed of one 1 and weren't the reason for losing in 2 more. if we look at the fourth most recent win you were definitly carried (2/2/5 with 66 cs 25 minutes in as adc) so that makes up for the one you should have won


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chris2423

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

02-23-2013

if u beleive in elo hell, make a smurf account. then see how easily you can carry games early on. u will notice pretty quickly that carrying against people who arent as good as you. the same will happen if u are gold level vs bronze level. if u are stuck in elo hell, it means that your skill level is very close to that of the people you are playing against.

everyone's elo hell is the range just below their actually skill level where they are slightly better than there opponents but not enough to carry.

and then there is the made up elo hell, where you are actually just bad and like to blame your teammates for losing.


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NastyNinja

Junior Member

02-23-2013

ELO Hell is around because players BECOME trolls ....This means nearly all the "trolls" start off each game with the intent to win ....They are birthed by a accident inside the game....Very few people go into a game looking to troll...People are converted during the game and start to "throw it" or "troll" ....I see plat players implode all day long...I see plats throw games just like bronze...but the big difference is the attitude after a huge mistake....

High rank ELO are a group of players with more reason to keep it together....They invested more time and effort.... When you're in the lower end ELO you get less care to keep emotions in check....Example... When people think "How in the hell is this person in my ELO" that's a troll birthing thought....Not even looking at how narrow minded it is to judge a person off 1 game but I have seen people judge a person off a single play gone wrong...

History has shown 2 great ways to keep toxic attitudes out from sports/games etc......

1. Putting an age limit on said sport/game.....Most narrow minded people will jump and say "I know a bunch of older people who rage just as hard" well first that's sad and second anybody here willing to take a team of new to the game 14 yr old's over a team of 35 yr old's?....btw this isn't an option.

2. Money ....Put money on the line and you will get a massive turn around in attitude.....If you only wanna pay 1$ for a hamburger expect to be in a place that will serve a 1$ hamburger .....For me? I'm willing to pay to not eat that garbage....I feel riot should either charge for the game "bad idea" or charge for ranked access "5-20$" and make normal's what they are...the 1$ hamburger shop......You download it play around and leave.....You pay if you wanna stay with other like minded players....


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Tetembay

Member

03-04-2013

[QUOTE=DieTrollDie;34973474]

Since Trolls are randomly distributed, your team has a 50% chance of getting the Troll.
Since getting the troll is an AUTOLOSS (on average) REGARDLESS of your skill level,
QUOTE]

This isn't exactly true. The chances of getting a troll on your team are actually stacked in your favor if you are not yourself a troll.

There is a 46% chance your team will have a troll because there are 4 possible trolls. There is a 56% chance the enemy team will have the troll. Therefore trolls will win you games as long as you don't afk or rage quit. There is a more detailed example of this on youtube that is worth watching. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MTO2a7ZFcc


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Dalek Hal

Senior Member

03-04-2013

ELO Hell only exists if you let it exist. It took me two days to Climb from Bronze 4 to 3. Playing maybe 10 games total.

Of those ten games I had 0 trolls on my team. We had one really really bad support voli bear. But he was only bad because he played voli support. That just doesn't work well in general. Every other game was pretty much good. There were other bad players scattered around but that didn't make them trolls. I went into only one of those games as a solo q. The rest were duo q. I also never called a roll, or if i did and someone else said they wanted it I would work with them to make sure they got a role they were comfortable with. End result: I lost 2 maybe 3 ranked games in two days. In general there was no one individual on my teams that carried the games. We all worked together. This is a team game, your team has to work together to win.

Now to address Elo Hell's existence:
-It doesn't exist
-Trolls are almost always created by selfishness in champ select, or raging at ppl in game
-Less skilled players are not trolls, they just need help knowing what to do to win

If you are willing to play several roles in champ select you can cut down on trolls
If you are constructive in game instead of a rager you can cut down on trolls
If you go into a game with a duo that does the same you should never have a troll


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