Theory on fixing "Elo hell"

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scattman98

Junior Member

02-23-2013

I don't feel like you are listening, people at that level do not target objectives. They chase champs around for kills, they don't ward, don't call Mia's, they feed, they troll, they flame. I have had games where I am unbelievably fed on a carry, and yet still, I cannot influence my team to win. They auto lock whatever they feel like in champion select, they argue over lanes. I can't carry them by myself, how am I supposed to win games and increase in Elo? I cooperate, kiss ass, try to help people, take positions, Outland opponents, get fed. Almost every game, and I rarely secure a win from it. I know other people in the same position. It's real, it's a trap, it's the bottom of the barrel. It isn't fair, and noone acts on it. It's not even close to the proper measurement of skill. I find it easy to win my lanes no matter who I choose, but I cannot 1v5.


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scattman98

Junior Member

02-23-2013

If you are just going to dispute everything I say, then have a backing to your points, otherwise don't waste my time.


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laxjoh

Senior Member

02-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by scattman98 View Post
If you are just going to dispute everything I say, then have a backing to your points, otherwise don't waste my time.
Fine you want a long detailed reason why ELO hell does NOT exist? Make sure you read it all; if you make a reply of something I addressed but you are oblivious to it, YOU don't waste MY or all of OUR times. First of all; this is the definition of elo hell. ELO hell means no matter how skilled you are at this game, you will never be able to climb out of the "ELO hell" because you will always lose from bad teammates.

Now take that definition into consideration. If this is true, then how do people who are very high in rankings get to where they are EVERY SEASON EVERY TIME? They make smurfs and are still able to climb to their designated ELO/rankings. Second, I myself was down at 800 ELO before the new ranking system. I climbed MYSELF up to 1280 before being put back into Bronze division in the new ranking system. I am now Silver going through the very same complaints people have about "League Hell" in the bronze division.

Next point we should talk about; the rep system. The current rep system was put into place so it gives people incentive not to cry/rage/argue with their teammates. You know what? It worked somewhat. It wasn't too crazy in the numbers but as soon as they implemented the rep system, people were generally nicer in game and more and more people said "GL HF" than before. YOUR rep system is flawed because it defeats the purpose of the ELO/MMR rank system. The reason why it nullifies the rank system is because the ranking measures not your individual skill but your win/loss rate. Now in the long run, if you play consistently every game, your MMR/ELO will eventually reflect your individual skill because if you play very well 90% of your games, you should win more matches than when you only play well 10% of the times. If you apply a rep system that will affect your rankings, how would that be justified? Ranking system is about your win/lose rate that will eventually reflect your skill level. If a irrelevant factor (although bannable in some cases) affects your rankings, that makes the ranking system flawed and thus you will TRULY create an "ELO HELL." How? Let's say Riot implements your system. Let's say there is an infamous ranking of bunch of Dbags and a-holes who do nothing but rage at each other and then feed. You've pretty much created ELO hell when it did not exist before. Why would Riot ever put such a system in place? If you got a teammate that rages/verbally harasses you, just mute him and then report him after the game.

People who believe in ELO hell complain A LOT about how they win lane but their team feeds or some other stupid reason. Take this into consideration. Even pros lose. EVERYONE will lose games. Sometimes, even the best players might go into a losing streak. The point is that if you are playing consistently (and very well at that), that's that much more you will contribute to a win. If you are fed but cannot carry, you simply need ONE DECENT player in your team to capitalize on being fed.

Next point: http://www.lolking.net/summoner/na/2...4#ranked-stats
This is your ranked stats. You should vastly try to prevent such a high death count. You've got some decent stats on few of them (like Cho'gath) but these champs are very easy to snowball with in low rankings because noobs don't know how to deal with such champs with good team fight kits. So instead of trying to win lane or do this and that, try to accumulate less and less deaths each game. If you are the best in your team, you shouldn't be dying. Not to mention you don't have too much experience under your belt either. Of your last 10 games, you have an average of 8.1 deaths. My average death in the last 10 games are 2.2. I used to be in the very same ranking as you in the lower end of bronze. Now in my opinion, I suck and I have much to improve on. I don't blame the ranking system/trolls/afkers/feeders/or bad attitude. I just play and improve myself. Sure this game isn't about KDA, but you should have no excuse to have over 5 deaths especially playing against these scrubs in the supposed "ELO hell." If they suck so much as you claim, why are you accumulating so much deaths? In Bronze 1 division, I climbed out playing Vayne (the shortest ranged ADC, lowest health pool, and gets countered by just about everyone). She also has the weakest early game and does pretty badly until late mid game to late game. Despite those facts, I have an average of 9/2/8 with Vayne in ranked. I get countered 90% of the times. Many of these games, it started out terribly and we've had enemy champs that were fed. We still won even with terrible teammates.

Instead of blaming the system, blaming others, blaming external issues; don't you think maybe it's just more reliable/better if you just improve YOUR INDIVIDUAL play and carry yourself out? The very fact that there are people who can carry themselves disproves the existence of ELO hell. Sure, bad players and d-bags will ruin games for you and you will lose. But realistically, assuming you are not the issue/troll in your team, your team has far less % chance of getting a troll in your team than the enemy team. So even if you get trolls or not, you SHOULD theoretically win 56% of your matches on paper.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MTO2a7ZFcc
This is a good video to disprove ELO hell. Also, Gbay gives a lot of good videos that help you improve your individual play. It's not a magic pill to get better. It's merely an advice and a new perspective. It's up to you on whether or not you can improve because you want to or you will remain where you are because all you do is complain or ask others to change something so you can climb rankings easier.


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scattman98

Junior Member

02-23-2013

You know what? Hats off to you. Initially that comment about my time was for the morons who said one thing and disliked comments and left. You have very strong well thought through valid points. And on me? You are exactly right. However, my last ten games where really ****ing horrible, 3 of them involved afks, one with a troll, 5ish I just played like ****, and the other one was just a ****show back door. I am stuck in this Elo because of the way I came into ranked play, and the way I approached these situations. I know that. But, I coulda caught a lot of breaks with at least SOME good teammates. Having said that, I admit to digging myself that hole. I am currently working back into 30 to get a fresh start. Anyway back on topic, I am targeting the trolls, and the people who join ranked just to try new things and **** around. It's not cool, and it needs to be stopped. It ruined the game experience for everyone. And the pros? They gained Elo in 5v5s. They had premade people. I am talking about solo duo, which sucks because it is trough in bronze to find a half decent player. I'm not trying to make it easier, I am trying to fix something that isn't right. But, having read your points, I realize a rep system just wouldn't work. Thank you for your time, and I'll be sure to watch that vid. I'm sure you have done this same discussion already, but what is wrong with trying to deter people from ****in the game up.


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laxjoh

Senior Member

02-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by scattman98 View Post
You know what? Hats off to you. Initially that comment about my time was for the morons who said one thing and disliked comments and left. You have very strong well thought through valid points. And on me? You are exactly right. However, my last ten games where really ****ing horrible, 3 of them involved afks, one with a troll, 5ish I just played like ****, and the other one was just a ****show back door. I am stuck in this Elo because of the way I came into ranked play, and the way I approached these situations. I know that. But, I coulda caught a lot of breaks with at least SOME good teammates. Having said that, I admit to digging myself that hole. I am currently working back into 30 to get a fresh start. Anyway back on topic, I am targeting the trolls, and the people who join ranked just to try new things and **** around. It's not cool, and it needs to be stopped. It ruined the game experience for everyone. And the pros? They gained Elo in 5v5s. They had premade people. I am talking about solo duo, which sucks because it is trough in bronze to find a half decent player. I'm not trying to make it easier, I am trying to fix something that isn't right. But, having read your points, I realize a rep system just wouldn't work. Thank you for your time, and I'll be sure to watch that vid. I'm sure you have done this same discussion already, but what is wrong with trying to deter people from ****in the game up.
I agree trolls suck. But the important thing about trolls is that they feed off of the more you rage. So the more you rage, the more the trolls win. The more you try to change the system for the worse even for trolls, they will still win. The best thing to do is to just ignore them and move on. It's hard and sometimes it's impossible to not feel angered. But you know what? If you mute them and don't talk to them, you will prevent further enraging yourself.

The current ranking system is about as good as it gets. IMO I liked the old ELO system better but this ranking system is more friendly for people like you and me who are on the lower end of the tier. If you continue playing consistently AND you play well, you will eventually climb up the rankings. Keep trying and good luck.


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LogicalTautology

Senior Member

02-23-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by scattman98 View Post
And the pros? They gained Elo in 5v5s. They had premade people. I am talking about solo duo, which sucks because it is trough in bronze to find a half decent player
This is completely incorrect. Countless times has a Pro taken a fresh 30 account, and through SoloQ alone gotten to Diamond. Usually with ridiculous (90%) winrates until they hit at least 1600.


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Onij

Member

02-24-2013

If elo hell exists how can people boost other people for money?


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