Riot; A long time AP Trynd player; These changes are perfect

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Ergheis

Senior Member

02-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Orenin View Post
yea like lategame especially, you just kind of screwed your team, I don't know how you win with it
Zhonya's
Massive Q Heal
GA
Ultimate.

You are one of the best distractions out there, simply because you still output enough damage to be a threat, but you are impossible to get rid of. All in all that's about 12 seconds of threat.


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Norak

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Senior Member

02-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ergheis View Post
I would rather they just break off Tryndamere's AP side and make a new champion built to do that (although they already have AP Nunu, which is just as annoying).

Honestly, "Variety" isn't building a specific AP build, Variety is about being able to build the many different Crit+AD+Attack+Movespeed+ArmorPen builds that are out there atm. People need to stop choking AD champions with their AP builds.
I have to disagree here. I see variety as the ability to play many champions, many different ways.

A great example of this is Nidalee. She can be a support, tank, AD bruiser (counter bruiser) and AP carry. This is fantastic and, in my opinion, the epitome of perfect balance. Maybe Nidalee isn't perfectly balanced (OP or UP,etc.), but the fact that she can be played in so many different ways makes this game more interesting.


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Galgus

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Senior Member

02-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norak View Post
I didn't main AP Ali, to be honest I didn't play him that much before the nerfs. When I did play him he was damn fun though. Even after the nerfs. He's not great though, agreed. I made a thread about him too:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...588&highlight=
They kept nerfing his ratios with the stated purpose of not wanting to nerf his ultimate, because they said it was a core part of him.

Then they nerfed his ultimate anyway without undoing any of the ratio nerfs.

But since he still gets played as a boring pure tank support or jungler occassionally, Riot will never consider reverting any of the changes.


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Sylvr

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Senior Member

02-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Orenin View Post
I don't understand how AP tryndamere does any damage? can somone enlighten me? OK you have a heal, great. But you do no damage... does not seem nerf worthy.
Damage isn't the only way to contribute to a team. Mostly, they're worried about his split-pushing, which is when one champion makes their way up Top or Bot lane and tries to kill towers while the rest of your team distracts the enemy team by threatening other objectives, such as the opposite side's tower or Baron. If the enemy team ignores the split-pusher, then they lose towers, and eventually Inhibitors. If they only send one person, then Trynd can easily put some damage on them, and then escape and heal to full within 20-30 seconds (usually even less), and then continue to push while the defender won't likely have as much sustain, and will have to recall, thereby allowing Trynd to put more damage on the tower. If they send multiple people, or if they send someone strong enough to actually kill Trynd (likely one of the strongest members of the team), then your team suddenly has an advantage and can engage the rest of the enemy team.

Additionally, if you ever find yourself in a teamfight as AP Trynd, then you can initiate on the enemy carries and force them to blow a ton of cooldowns on you, and then just heal it right back up before the teamfight is even over. Even without AD items, Tryndamere is still strong enough that they can't ignore him when he's sitting on your squishies.


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Norak

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Senior Member

02-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ergheis View Post
Zhonya's
Massive Q Heal
GA
Ultimate.

You are one of the best distractions out there, simply because you still output enough damage to be a threat, but you are impossible to get rid of. All in all that's about 12 seconds of threat.
He deals mediocre damage in mid laning phase, but his damage only drops off unless he gets fed or absolute free farm. In which case he deals mediocre damage all game long. The way you're making him sound is like old Morde, build tank and deal enough base damage to be a threat. An unkillable threat.

That's not the way it is, though. People just focus trynd and get mad when he heals and spins away. Focus his carries and leave him til last. Though, I agree his healing is obnoxious. Not easy to counter, not the most fun thing to play against. Good that it's getting changed, however they need to balance it out so hes' not completely useless.


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Kroa

Senior Member

02-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by imweasel09 View Post
If they have 0 towers left i think AP trynd's already done his job if you've got 3 bare inhibs you probably going to lose.

If you read what i said, if the game lasted that long, your turrets are pretty much usually gone as well. and even if they arent, at 40-50 mins, if you didnt manage to win and still have your turrets, then AP tryn still wont help you much to secure the victory.


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Ryc Nairda

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Senior Member

02-21-2013

I just played against AP Tryndamere as Nasus. He got destroyed. His healing was annoying, but he couldn't run away from me because my slow is too OP.


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Eve The Ripper

Senior Member

02-21-2013

They're probably going to focus on his AD side, in all honesty. Given his potential power there, I don't see them risking pushing him over the top trying to make AP Trynd viable and not annoying.

I mean, if he can't heal as much (it's like a 33% nerf or so?), then what's he going to do? Buffing the base damage on his spin would buff his AD build, so that's likely out.


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Celenphor

Senior Member

02-21-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norak View Post
I've played AP Trynd since before season 1, as some of you may remember. I've been trying to put AP Trynd on the map for a long time now. For those that think I'm just a hipster AP Trynd:
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...d.php?t=938025

These nerfs to AP Trynd mean that you can finally fix the problems with his kit, right?
Tryndamere's Q cooldown is so long that you can't heal-ult-heal. If you heal before you ult then, unless you have max CDR, chances are you are going to be running around with 1hp. I've brought this up multiple times.

Trynd's passive is counter intuitive. You should swap it back with his Q again, so that the lower hp he is the more fury he generates.

Trynd's spin has terrible base damage, his whole kit is countered by armor, yet he can't pull anything crazy off like Riven can. It should deal magic damage and the AD ratio should be reduced in favour of a higher base damage.

If you're going to nerf his obnoxious healing, but don't want to destroy an absolutely fun build then fix the flaws in his kit. I feel like a broken record repeating all this so often, but it's the best way to get it seen and considered.

If you want a more indepth analysis of Trynd, then follow this link: http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2858712

Don't feel like these nerfs are the end of AP Trynd, find the silver lining. Nerfing his healing opens a world of possibilities in terms of fixing his kit. If you think this AP Trynd is fun, then you should have experienced the prenerf AP Trynd.
These nerfs are a knee jerk reaction, period.

I agree with you 100% though, it's a shame none of this will happen since it's easier for them to simply delete the build all together with crippling nerfs than to adresss the concerns you've raised, I don't even play Trynd but I'm saddened by Riot's moves here.


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RazvanC88

Junior Member

02-21-2013

Thumbs up my man


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