Let us choose our role before queueing

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Sikozu

Member

02-28-2013

Here's a more detailed idea of a possible position queue system for Normal/Ranked Solo/Duo queue ONLY.

*Teams do not need a position system as it should be done prior
*Long post


[ ] Top Lane (AD)
[ ] Top Lane (AP)
[ ] Middle Lane
[ ] Bottom Lane (AD)
[ ] Bottom Lane (AP)
[ ] Jungle Lane

*(A 1-6 system of populating the fields will be used to signal the player's lane preferences. To say you won't play a specific lane can be identified by simply leaving it's field blank.)
*(A new report option will be added to the Post-Game Lobby. It will say, "Queue Abuse - Refused to play Selected Lane)
*(An icon/text indicator would be placed next to each players name to signal what position they were queued for and assigned to (if they selected multiple positions).

Okay, so the biggest problem with doing a Position Queue is making it so Riot isn't changing the queue system every time the Meta changes. Below is why and how I feel what I'm suggesting will work with a variable Meta.

Q: Why aren't roles being identified in the queue choices?
A: There are simply just too many roles to try to make a queue system that could form a team that would be viable. Doing it by position works, as it still allows some wiggle room for players to customize the team and not feel locked into a certain form or style of play.

Q: Why are some lanes broken into AD/AP?
A: This is to create a bit of structure in double lanes, while still giving the players some options. Using Bottom lane as an example. The system would try to pair an AD and an AP in that lane together. Since a majority of Support champions are AP (or have the capacity to play as AP), you can play in the current Meta if you wish. So if you wanted to support, you would pick Bottom Lane (AP) and if you wanted to ADC you would do Bottom Lane (AD). this doesn't mean you have to play to the Meta though. The players could choose to do a double kill lane if they wanted to. In essence, this allows the Meta to be followed, or ignored, but gives some structure to teams in the lobby. The division also helps to prevent a team from being lopsided in their damage type.

Q: What if I really want to play Mid, but I'm willing to play Support also?
A: This can be done, using the 1-6 indicators, you would put a [1] in Middle Lane, a [2] in Bottom Lane (AP) and/or Top Lane (AP), while leaving the other lanes blank. If you really want to have Support be a last resort pick, put it in as a [6] so it gets looked at only in longer queue waits.

Q: If I do the above example, isn't there a chance I could get Top Lane solo as an AP champion?
A: Yes you could. This will not eliminate ALL of the team coordination needed in the champion select lobby, just reduce it some.

Q: How would the this system prioritize the positions?
A: The queue would attempt to form teams in a process of elimination method, meaning it would look for things in the following order before moving to the next criteria.
1st
Top Lane (AD) or Top Lane (AP)
Middle Lane
Bottom Lane (AD)
Bottom Lane (AP)
Jungle Lane
2nd
Top Lane (AD)
Top Lane (AP)
Middle Lane
Bottom Lane (AD) or Bottom Lane (AP)
Jungle Lane
3rd
Top Lane (AD)
Top Lane (AP)
Middle Lane
Bottom Lane (AD)
Bottom Lane (AP)
They system would look at everyone's picks marked [1] and try to make team, then everyone's [1] and [2], and so on. Probably spending 15seconds at each interval before expanding to the next tier of player choices.

Q: Isn't it still possible to get some weird team compositions?
A: Yes it is. This is designed to create some order in an inherently chaotic world where strangers are expected to work together. Player's still have the option to not follow the queues, if the team decides they want a jungler, and the System didn't give them one.

Q: Won't this increase Queue times?
A: It most certainly will, but it will also reduce queue dodging. so in a way, it may actually decrease the theoretical queue time. For example, if you sit in queue for 30seconds currently, but go through 2 queue dodges, wasting roughly 2minute in the Champion Select Lobby each time, that's a theoretical queue time of 30+120+30+120+30=5.5min queue. If the new system can perform at consistently low time, it is an improvement.

Q: Won't some positions have super quick queue times compared to others?
A: Yes they will, but if a player chooses to only play Middle Lane, this will stop the need to queue dodge when you get into a game with some one else wanting to play Middle Lane. Reducing the occurrence of "Mid or Feed" type events(Trolling).

Q: What if some one gets a position and they refuse to play it? (Troll)
A: There will be a new reporting option at the end of the game where players can be reported for "Being a jerk" by abusing the system and refusing to cooperate with the team. You will be able to tell if they are abusing the system as their queued position (or assigned position if they queued multiple positions) is displayed next to their name.

Summary
This is a good foundation that I'm hoping the Community and Riot will take notice of. Assuming it is liked I'm more than happy to add more Q & A to it.

[EDIT]
*Fixed some typos and grammar.
*Added details on an icon/text graphic that would identify what "Position" people are assigned by the queue system.
*Added details information to some of the Q & A to address the above edit more clearly.
*Changed the occurrence of the word "Role" to "Position" to help clarify that this is not assigning a Role to a player, to allow an open, but soft Meta team composition.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Calcifer83

Member

02-28-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladayen View Post
Select any role for fast queue.. get in game TOP OR FEED!!

Role selection wouldn't really solve anything
that would be reportable.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Calcifer83

Member

02-28-2013

would use this que like 2x/day. out of like 4 games played.
would use this que despite a 6 minute wait time.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Varyll

Junior Member

03-01-2013

I really don't see why everyone opposes this idea; if I pick support, you're damn sure I'm going it because I want to, not because of a que. You forget, there needs to be damage dealers as well, so your ques won't be too long. If I que for support, you know I'm picking it because I want to, and because I feel I would be beneficial as a support hero, or a tank for instance. By having my role pre determined, I'm letting my team know that I'm committed to playing my role well, or else I would go a different role. Obviously, there needs to be planned picking, but there is always a way to pick a certain role that has it's advantages and disadvantages. Depending on how your team is feeling, you can change to a hero that would be more suitable. If you want to que as a damage dealer, do so because you want to. Not everyone does. Every pro will tell you it comes down to the support for most games. By me picking a role ahead of time is letting you know I specifically want to fill this role, in any way I can. When matched with people who want to play other roles, there is no quarrel over who goes what. We talk, and decide from there as a team. This whole mantra of "I'm picking first, and I really couldn't care, because I'm going to report you for not filling a role" is ridiculous. At least in HoN, we have the fair option of everyone deciding if he's kicked or not. It takes 9 people to agree to kick another player- it's up to you as players to be the change you want to see.

EDIT: If you're only always picking AD or top lane, then you should be punished with long que times. Man up, and learn different roles and be useful to your team. It's not fun when everyone goes adc to be the "spotlight hero who carried everything and got the most kills". I enjoy a good game, even when I lose. I'm thankful that I've gotten to see their strategies, as well as pick up some tricks they might have used while gaming, and maybe I could use them to improve my strategy. I play every hero, every role they can go and still be viable. I will happily wait for a longer que time to play adc, because I desire other roles just as equally. If you guys played HoN or Dota2 you would realize there is more than one way to play a hero, and more than one way to shape or alter the game's meta. Stop focusing on where champions go so much, and communicate with your team, by taking advantage of your strengths, and avoiding your weaknesses at all possible times through coordination and understanding. Aim fora better environment in which the game can be fun again, not this twisted visage of a former glorious game. The community is plagued with attention seekers and competitive hotheads who get furious for tiny mistakes, and it's a crying shame that there aren't many noble players anymore it seems.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Sikozu

Member

03-06-2013

bump


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

ibnfadlanIII

Senior Member

03-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladayen View Post
Select any role for fast queue.. get in game TOP OR FEED!!

Role selection wouldn't really solve anything
agreed every time this gets brought up people portray it as a kind of silver bullet to pregame selection problems. Role selection won't filter out the *******s. I'm not going to call on riot to completely revamp the matchmaking system, for something that is likely to create just as many problems as it claims to solve.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Sikozu

Member

03-06-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by ibnfadlanIII View Post
agreed every time this gets brought up people portray it as a kind of silver bullet to pregame selection problems. Role selection won't filter out the *******s. I'm not going to call on riot to completely revamp the matchmaking system, for something that is likely to create just as many problems as it claims to solve.
It isn't a "silver bullet" but it is an improvement, and as you didn't fully read the post, I'll point out what I think you missed.

*(A new report option will be added to the Post-Game Lobby. It will say, "Queue Abuse - Refused to play Selected Lane)

While not a "silver bullet" it would at least allow pre-game trolls/abusers to be punished. It is also only being presented for as a solution for one Queue System. So it is not a "revamp" of the game, just a tweak to a small piece of it to improve the experience.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Yhufir

Senior Member

03-07-2013

In theory this is a good idea. I would love to see it implemented, even if only for a day/week, to see how it works out.
The people who are nay-saying have a legitimate point; people could easily abuse the system to avoid long Qs. For those of you that suggest we add a new reportable, you have to understand a few things:
1) Preventing people from playing champs in a role not classically assigned them, we effectively cement the meta and that's counterproductive to the game as a whole (for obvious reasons)
2) It would be difficult to actually cite people for not playing their designated roles because, again, you can use any champ in any role and not be "trolling" - I'm not saying that would be a large MINORITY of the cases but I've done it and can't imagine I'm the only one (Ashe support - Caitlyn Top/Jungle, etc...)
3) Abusing this new system, by simply selecting All/Any, wouldn't have any negative effect on the transgressor except the reporting system (which, as I've already pointed out, would be difficult if not impossible to enforce). This would force people to change their role to accommodate and then they too would be accountable for not playing their predesignated role.

I still think this is a great idea. But, trolls will be trolls.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Sikozu

Member

03-08-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yhufir View Post
1) Preventing people from playing champs in a role not classically assigned them, we effectively cement the meta and that's counterproductive to the game as a whole (for obvious reasons)
I'm assuming that you're responding to the proposal I made, with that said: what was suggested is position based. So it actually leaves a lot of variability in the team. Essentially all it does is say, "Hey I'm playing in this lane with an AD (or AP) champion!", the AP/AD designation is to prevent a team from being lopsided to one type of damage over another. This in no way locks in a Meta, though an argument could be made that if you want to experiment with a New Meta, it is better done with a pre-made team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yhufir View Post
2) It would be difficult to actually cite people for not playing their designated roles because, again, you can use any champ in any role and not be "trolling" - I'm not saying that would be a large MINORITY of the cases but I've done it and can't imagine I'm the only one (Ashe support - Caitlyn Top/Jungle, etc...)
Actually no it won't be difficult to actually site people. There would be some sort of Icon next to everyone's name in that signaled what "Position" they were queued with. It would be very visible who is violating and who is cooperating. (I did not mention this and will add it to my proposal) By having this be regulated by a reportable offence, it would let the existing Tribunal System decide, based on chat logs from the "Champion Select Lobby", to "Pardon - Punish", as it should be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yhufir View Post
3) Abusing this new system, by simply selecting All/Any, wouldn't have any negative effect on the transgressor except the reporting system (which, as I've already pointed out, would be difficult if not impossible to enforce). This would force people to change their role to accommodate and then they too would be accountable for not playing their predesignated role.
Again, by selecting ALL the "Positions" to ensure a quick Queue time would still be punishable easily with a report. As once again, the game would tell you what "Position" you were assigned to in the Team Composition. Choosing ALL the "Positions" would NOT put you into a Team with the liberty to bump someone from a queued position. You will be assigned a specific position within the Team Composition. If you decided to not play that position, see my above comment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yhufir View Post
I still think this is a great idea. But, trolls will be trolls.
Very true indeed, and very unfortunate.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Yhufir

Senior Member

03-08-2013

I think, by assigning everyone a role AND a damage type, we’re really boxing ourselves in. We need the ability to adapt to strategic and circumstantial changes. Why can’t a team of all AD or all AP be allowed? What if everyone is willing to try a full AP comp? The argument can be made for experimental meta to be done exclusively in premades, but so can the argument for edible computers (I don’t want to leave my desk and waste my lunch time walking somewhere to get my lunch)(it’s a bad example, I know, but I’m hungry).
I don’t mean difficult in terms of figuring out who did what “against the rules” but difficult because you’re forcing everyone to play the meta as it exists now. That’s not against the rules. NOT PLAYING META IS NOT AGAINST THE RULES (and never should be).
I’ll go this far with you: Having people pick a lane before going in to a game might work. Having them pick a role is too constricting. Having people pick a lane and then go to a different lane is still easy enough for the truly trollish.