how to fix rengar

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alfavhunter

Senior Member

02-12-2013

step 1

base armor increased by 4, armor per level reduced to make his armor the same end level (this is an early game jungle sustain buff)

step 2

rengars battle roar does 50% more damage to minions and jungle mobs (again, early game jungle buff) and passively give him 2/4/6/8/10 armor pen (late game buff as most rengars level this ability last)

step 3

rengars Q scaling is now 1.1 ad (from 1.0) with the ferocity bonus at 2.2 (from 2.0) bonus (primarily later game buff, reduce early rank base damage by 5 to prevent early game buff ( example, base damage would become 25/55/85/120/150 from 30/60/90/120/150) (this is a late game buff)

step 4

rengars ultimate loses delay as it is levels, rank 1 would have a max of 3 sec delay, level 2 would have only the base delay, and rank 3 would have instant stealth, this makes his ult feel ultimate again as it get stronger, but prevents the early level get out of gank free card (because pink wards are sooo expensive... especially when you know your fighting a stealth-er...)

step 5

make rengars item 9T effect base line (the improved leap range, this makes this item more ideal for laning and jungle for increased leap range for ganks or hurrassing without it being plain damage boost effect)

remove the normal + 5 ad from the base effect

replace the 9T bonus with this

when rengar pounces an enemy with unseen predator he reveals them for 4 seconds

now many would argue that rengar has a mediocer late game because his early game is good, well, that was once the case, he had a great early game, until cry foulers got his early game nerfed into oblivion

his early game is now worse than Xin's with his late game worse than Xin's (Xin is just an example of an early game champ btw, this applies for rengar compared to many other champions as well btw), so i think he does need some buffs for late and early game, but thinks that really need to be done is make his ult more ultimate as it feels like twitches Q atm... and make his jungle more reasonable as he is lore and design wise supposed to jungle, but hes horrible at it, so fix that (and btw making his W do bonus damage to minions / jungle mobs is a great way to do this without buffing his damage vs champions)

so, these are just my thoughts, if you agree +1, if not, don't just down-vote, tell me what you disagree with, and don't just say rengars fine, i played wow as a hunter since release, and until recently hunters were always claimed to be 'fine' but never were (bad in end level pvp and pve, not fine, had nothing to contribute that other classes didn't do better) until recently, and even then its still a questionable argument for this issue as hunter's still lack utility compared to many classes (and this is just comparing dps specs)


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ZachTheApathetic

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Interesting fix to his ult. I like it. This is another good fix suggestion I've seen recently. I sincerely hope he gets buffed to some extent soon.


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Sneaky Thing

Senior Member

02-13-2013

I played against a Rengar who dominated my team recently. He would ult, leap in, combo someone, and just walk out because his roar gives him tankiness when it hits more than one person.

We killed him a few times, but he was free to kill one of my allies every time his ult came up because he can jump over walls and usually started in bushes, so my Oracle's did nothing and I had no money for that many vision wards.

Rengar is fine. Stop trying to buff him.


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BoresRaptor

Senior Member

02-13-2013

sorry but no, rengar just need ulti without stupid 3 seco delay

and rengar item need new buff


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Infinitystorm16

Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sneaky Thing View Post
I played against a Rengar who dominated my team recently. He would ult, leap in, combo someone, and just walk out because his roar gives him tankiness when it hits more than one person.

We killed him a few times, but he was free to kill one of my allies every time his ult came up because he can jump over walls and usually started in bushes, so my Oracle's did nothing and I had no money for that many vision wards.

Rengar is fine. Stop trying to buff him.
His roar doesn't give him more tankiness when it hits more than one person, wtf u talking about.

Also how is he not getting cc'd after he jumps someone, rengar has no escapes in his kit if he used his ult to jump onto someone.

From what i just read there, that means that your team was never really all together and there was usually always someone alone (or far enough from the team that he/she might as well have been alone). Thats a gameplay issue, not a "rengar is fine dont buff him" issue.


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ZachTheApathetic

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sneaky Thing View Post
I played against a Rengar who dominated my team recently. He would ult, leap in, combo someone, and just walk out because his roar gives him tankiness when it hits more than one person.

We killed him a few times, but he was free to kill one of my allies every time his ult came up because he can jump over walls and usually started in bushes, so my Oracle's did nothing and I had no money for that many vision wards.

Rengar is fine. Stop trying to buff him.
im sure this can happen, any fed champ can do this, but how OFTEN does it happen? hardly ever for rengar. He has the second lowest win rate right now. Threads aren't debating whether or not he needs a buff, its HOW buff him.


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alfavhunter

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoresRaptor View Post
sorry but no, rengar just need ulti without stupid 3 seco delay

and rengar item need new buff

that is what part of this suggestion is

1 of the parts is ult delay removal and item buff, other part addresses his considerable late game fall of, considering his early game is not outrageous enough to justify as bad a late game as he has.

and the last thing this suggestion tries to fix is his atrocious early jungle issues, for someone who is designed as a jungle (and an early game champion supposedly), his sustain is trash, or if he focuses on sustain, his speed is trash, that is the issue the early jungle buffs fix because more armor early on means less damage in jungle taken, more damage when using the survival tool (aka W) improves his sustain trade off vs speed making him able to move a little faster in jungle even when focusing on sustain (and this buff would nock off about maybe 1-2 seconds per camp because with a +50% damage to minions the lvl 1 roar will do ~75 damage instead of 50, which is about + one 2/3 a low level AA improvement so he might spend 1 less AA when using the W+fW, nothing more), which atm, slows him down way to much

so honestly i dont think im askign for anything unreasonable, the delay decay per level prevents the get out of gank free card early on, but makes his ult useful later on

the jungle changes speed him up a little when he is focusing on sustaining himself, and do little ofr the plow through jungle screw sustain method

and the item gets what it should have had from the start, a non damage base stat that is useful for both jungler and laner rengars, while replacing the 9T bonus (which will now be baseline) with something that works with rengars passive and ult much better for a reward factor, making him able to get people even when stealthing (he is a hunter after all)

so in all honesty, he needs some late game buffs, he needs early jungle buffs, he needs his ult to have an ultimate flavor to it for end game, and he needs his item to feel useful

the changes i proposed do all of that without going overboard and making him need a nerf


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alfavhunter

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoresRaptor View Post
sorry but no, rengar just need ulti without stupid 3 seco delay

and rengar item need new buff

that is just it, if you make up for rengars flaws with his special item, then everyone HAS to get it, that is why i suggest making his item provide a useful aspect that isn't 'helps me rip someones face off' but is 'helps me stay on them or get to them to rip their face off'

and fixing some of his other flaws in the champion himself with some reasonable trade offs in some areas (his early jungle clear does need a little buff, if you argue that you have not jungled with him or you were just up against bads)

ult needs improvement, item needs improvement, we are both in agree-ance on that, but his late game needs a little buff for his early game is no longer as outrageous as it once was (which is why his late game was reasonable to have so mediocre, but no longer), and his jungle needs a early game buff which is taken care of with a little extra 'creep only' damage boost and a little extra early armor for sustain, improving sustain and jungle speed slightly


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TheApeGod

Junior Member

02-13-2013

draven needs a skin


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Bamboo Worrior

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Hi, I played Rengar alot recently, and I believe my post about bufing rengar was the first proposal after season 3. some old players said his role in team has changed, well since I havent played as Rengar before, I'm not in the position to say. However, I think he is quite fine, Rengar can carry the team before 20 mins, and in late game, just build more tanky to become off-tank. your priority target has always to be ADC, my last game was 15/7/14, well, I died alot, that unevitable, as he was backdooring, easy to be focused, but a jungler trade with adc, that worth alot.


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