What is the reasoning behind champions with free abilities?

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Darkbyte

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesog View Post
BB puts out less than shunpo, thus less burst.
You are right in everything but this. This is just pure BS. With the same amount of gold BB does FAR more damage than shunpo


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Shinzengumi

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Senior Member

10-25-2010

Manaless/Cooldown based and HP based abilities were done to make LoL unique from other MOBA games (as compared to DoTA, dunno about HoN coz I haven't played much of it.)


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Cesog

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkbyte View Post
You are right in everything but this. This is just pure BS. With the same amount of gold BB does FAR more damage than shunpo
with 2 BF swords, or 3700 gold, at lvl 11 BB rank 5 does

288.2 damage, with a CD of 8 seconds 188.2 (Base+2 BF)+100 bonus


3450 gold, or a zhonyas, shunpo does...

300 damage. 210 base+90 AP ratio damage

with a CD of 6 seconds, and the bonus of a zhonyas proc protection..


tyvm


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TL Frolo

Senior Member

10-25-2010

mana would potentially break kat
35% scaling off ap on her ult when you have ~1k ap (dont bull**** me about stacking AA's not being viable because ad kat's stack BFs the same way)


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LinaFireSong

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesog View Post
ooook.

first, squishy is in relation to health/armor. AP kat will have more health, thus less squishy.

Second, burst damage is the amount you can put out at once. BB puts out less than shunpo, thus less burst.

AP kat can and should get CDR items, leading to lower CDR.

so no, AP kat has less squish, less CDs, and higher burst.


/bow tyvm.


and if you are shunpoing into the middle of 5 enemies...YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG :O
You can't say AP kat has more HP because it's the same for both without items, and WITH items, DP kat has better item choices with more HP buff.

While it's true Shunpo has higher BASE damage than BB, BB has better damage ratio, so once you get your B.F swords, BB becomes more powerful than Shunpo

Maybe AP has more cooldown items, but CDR isn't as important to Kat due to her passive. I play DP and my abilities are ready most of the time anyway.

Imagine you are laning, it may not be five opponents, maybe just two, it's still a bad idea to shunpo in the middle of them. Shunpo is squish! So you have to spend your early game, carefully walk around farming minions, while DP kat can spam BB to harrase, ward off or even kill opponents right from the beginning.


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Cesog

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by LinaFireSong View Post
You can't say AP kat has more HP because it's the same for both without items, and WITH items, DP kat has better item choices with more HP buff.

While it's true Shunpo has higher BASE damage than BB, BB has better damage ratio, so once you get your B.F swords, BB becomes more powerful than Shunpo

Maybe AP has more cooldown items, but CDR isn't as important to Kat due to her passive. I play DP and my abilities are ready most of the time anyway.

Imagine you are laning, it may not be five opponents, maybe just two, it's still a bad idea to shunpo in the middle of them. Shunpo is squish! So you have to spend your early game, carefully walk around farming minions, while DP kat can spam BB to harrase, ward off or even kill opponents right from the beginning.

Read the above post with the math....also, CDR is always important to kat, because you cant always rely on getting kills. 2nd of all, what DPS items give health in any large degree?

Frozen mallet for the whopping 20 AD?


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Darkbyte

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesog View Post
with 2 BF swords, or 3700 gold, at lvl 11 BB rank 5 does

288.2 damage, with a CD of 8 seconds 188.2 (Base+2 BF)+100 bonus


3450 gold, or a zhonyas, shunpo does...

300 damage. 210 base+90 AP ratio damage

with a CD of 6 seconds, and the bonus of a zhonyas proc protection..


tyvm
Bouncing Blade hits 6 people... Thats 1729 Damage vs 300 Damage for shunpo


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Eddy01741

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramdonperson View Post
The whole point of diversity in a team game is that some characters are great early-game and become more useless as time goes on.. other characters are exactly the opposite. Why do the early-game advantage champs annoy you? If Garen's in your lane just sit back and think about how much you're going to roll his face in 20 mins.
Xin zhao and Pantheon are early game champions. THey also have mana. I can't spam charge, battle cry and TTS with xin zhao and expect not to run out of mana early game (late game, hell yeah!), why should Garen be able to spam all his abilities and faceroll a FB?


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TL Frolo

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkbyte View Post
Bouncing Blade hits 6 people... Thats 1729 Damage vs 300 Damage for shunpo
AP kat shnpo hits for 700 minimum
BB can only be used for poking not chasing


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Cesog

Senior Member

10-25-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkbyte View Post
Bouncing Blade hits 6 people... Thats 1729 Damage vs 300 Damage for shunpo
IF they are around, IF they are in range, IF there are no minions in the way...IF they have no armor (Which is more common than MR), IF they dont have banshees.

Base damage shunpo>BB