Suggestions about getting out of Bronze 5?

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MrSelfDestructt

Junior Member

08-26-2013

This topic seems to be a common post, but I'm really struggling getting out of this elo bracket. There has to be something I'm doing or not doing that is preventing me from winning >~50% of games.

My reasoning is that I'm the only common factor in all of these games. I practice CSing, I've stuck to a small subset of champions, I buy wards, I watch the minimap and I have a relatively decent grasp on the basic mechanics of the game. I honestly don't know where I need to spend my time improving. I'm here asking because if this is truly the case, then theres something I need to improve that I can't see.

The one thing I see a lot of these posts mention is "its not me its my teammates". I do feel that my teammates have to be a contributing factor to the game loss, since it is a team game, but I try not to think this way, and only focus on what I can change.

I have some LoLreplay games that were made in some of last 10 matches I played, but the application seems to have issues uploading. I can provide these on request.

My LolKing Profile:
http://www.lolking.net/summoner/na/24155782

Also, please do not post if you don't have anything constructive to say.


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Whoa There Betsy

Senior Member

08-26-2013

don't die


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Kivin100

Senior Member

08-26-2013

The simple and unfortunate fact of the matchmaking/ELO system is that, if you don't carry the game to a win, nobody else will do it for you. Surely not consistently enough to get you to and through a promotion series.

That being said, it's on you to be the very best you can be at a particular role. You must be consistently and visibly better than your team mates and opponents at some such thing. There's no reason to expect your team mates to play like they're in a division or two higher than they are. Only you can expect that of yourself.

One thing I do notice is that your death count tends to be fairly high. Deaths are costly in terms of time, experience, and income and if you do nothing else but cut your deaths in half, it'll give you the chance to do more things to help your team win.


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Spooky Ghostie

Junior Member

08-26-2013

While im only n bronze 2 or 3 myself, i've found that running jungle is a very good way to climb up, as it is easy to control the pace of the game.


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MrSelfDestructt

Junior Member

08-27-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kivin100 View Post
The simple and unfortunate fact of the matchmaking/ELO system is that, if you don't carry the game to a win, nobody else will do it for you. Surely not consistently enough to get you to and through a promotion series.

That being said, it's on you to be the very best you can be at a particular role. You must be consistently and visibly better than your team mates and opponents at some such thing. There's no reason to expect your team mates to play like they're in a division or two higher than they are. Only you can expect that of yourself.

One thing I do notice is that your death count tends to be fairly high. Deaths are costly in terms of time, experience, and income and if you do nothing else but cut your deaths in half, it'll give you the chance to do more things to help your team win.
Thank you for the response. Naturally the goal would be to never give up a death, how many deaths do you feel would be acceptable if you were looking at it from a stats perspective? I was told and have been working under the assumption that anything below 6 deaths in a 30 min+ game is normal. Again, I understand the goal should be to never die, but that can get rather impractical in some cases. Also, there are times when I do give up deaths in questionable decisions, which I've realized and I try to actively manage that better (after a face palm).

I've found in the last few games that I've died trying to engage in a team fight, and my team compromised their effectiveness as a group, which causes most if not all of us to be killed. I think the most common way this happens is someone sees an enemy champion running into the jungle and decides to follow them. I also see a lot of engaging one or two enemies without knowing where the rest of the enemy team is. I ping to back off, but it seems to be hit or miss if a teammate will listen.

The first thing I think is that I shouldn't put myself in that situation. However, on the other hand, if I don't try to follow the group as they engage the enemy team, then the group starts raging. If the surrounding area isn't properly warded, then I'm at risk pushing a tower or going after another objective. I typically buy a sight stone if no one else is buying wards, or if they are, pick up a few extra wards to fill in the blank areas.

Do you have any thoughts on this? Should I go with the team or should I try to get another objective?


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Kivin100

Senior Member

08-27-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSelfDestructt View Post
Thank you for the response. Naturally the goal would be to never give up a death, how many deaths do you feel would be acceptable if you were looking at it from a stats perspective? I was told and have been working under the assumption that anything below 6 deaths in a 30 min+ game is normal. Again, I understand the goal should be to never die, but that can get rather impractical in some cases. Also, there are times when I do give up deaths in questionable decisions, which I've realized and I try to actively manage that better (after a face palm).

I've found in the last few games that I've died trying to engage in a team fight, and my team compromised their effectiveness as a group, which causes most if not all of us to be killed. I think the most common way this happens is someone sees an enemy champion running into the jungle and decides to follow them. I also see a lot of engaging one or two enemies without knowing where the rest of the enemy team is. I ping to back off, but it seems to be hit or miss if a teammate will listen.

The first thing I think is that I shouldn't put myself in that situation. However, on the other hand, if I don't try to follow the group as they engage the enemy team, then the group starts raging. If the surrounding area isn't properly warded, then I'm at risk pushing a tower or going after another objective. I typically buy a sight stone if no one else is buying wards, or if they are, pick up a few extra wards to fill in the blank areas.

Do you have any thoughts on this? Should I go with the team or should I try to get another objective?
There's never an easy answer to this. I think it comes down to various factors. For one, if you're playing a carry role (AP Mid, AD Carry), you shouldn't really be dying hardly ever. Especially in a team fight. If you die as AD Carry and your team hadn't wiped first, you were probably out of position. There's lots of videos on team fighting and positioning out there, I recall. Here's a short video explaining just how bad your deaths are: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4cTEpSzZcM. In the end, I would just reflect on my deaths, one at a time, and ask if it really was justified.

For example, if you're getting jungle ganked in lane. That's easy to remedy. If you're dying in a battle to the death with your lane opponent, you can either play safer (on the tower), freeze the creep wave instead of pushing, learn the match up better (realize that you can't fight them while certain abilties are/aren't on cooldown, etc), have better awareness of things like summoner spells (I have my ignite/ult, he doesn't).

If you're the initiator, then you're probably going to die a few times just on that principal alone; sometimes team fights just go sour and that's that.

If your mates are fighting and one or more enemies are missing, there's a couple possibilities:

1. They know something you don't. They watched the minimap and saw the enemy appear briefly in another lane, but you missed it. In which case you could be hanging your team out to dry by not helping them.

2. They're making a mistake. This is very common. It's especially common for players to chase enemies in to fog without information on enemy positions. Unfortunately there isn't much you can do about this, but the good news is that your foes are just as likely to do it as your mates. If you're going to ping warning, I would use the loud red one (control-up) instead of just a ping, since it tends to get peoples' attentions better and snap them out of bloodlust.


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obnoxiousplayz

Junior Member

08-27-2013

Okay this post may be a bit long so bear with me. I am currently logged onto my alt account account my main is doomster01 http://www.lolking.net/summoner/na/2...7#ranked-stats

It looks like you play a lot of ADC. For this I would recommend running 4% in lifesteal quints an AD quint, AD Marks, Flat Armor yellows, and Mr/level glyphs. This gives you the best trading potential in lane and allows you to sustain in lane early with just a doran's blade (which also gives extra tankiness).

For aggressive supports who attack the enemy champions especially from melee (thresh blitz leona). I have found the best option is Flat health quints, AD Marks, Armor Seals, and either flat mr or mr/lvl glyphs. This allows you to usually play more aggressive against the enemy support and allows you the ability to take some harass while staying in lane. I also run a full consumable build on my supports. My standard starting items are 2 pink wards, 2 green wards, 2 health pots, 1 mana pot (or 3 hp pots if my champion doesn't have mana issues like leona or a janna). Having 2 pink wards allows you to establish early bush dominance in lane and can help snowball the lane into your favor and zone out the enemy adc.

Now, for general gameplay. Supports and jungles generally do not want to take kills from their solo lanes. In general as a jungler you are only affecting the lanes when you gank. This means that your kills only matter during ganks whereas a laner can use that kill to gain an advantage through their entire laning/teamfighting during the game. Also, 1-2 early kills on a support can be good if you are using them effectively and ZONING the opposing adc off of farm and helping gain your adc an advantage. However, if you plan on staying passive on your support all kills should go to the adc. Now since it seems like you play bot lane for the most part I will give you this piece of advice. Take free backs when they are offered to you and try to prevent your opponent from backing whenever you can. If you get a kill on their support or adc, push the lane to their turret as fast as possible using skills/aa's/jungle help/etc. This throws the minions into their turret while you go buy items with the 4-800 gold you got from kills or farm and gives you an item advantage on their adc. The best part of this is usually you are gone long enough that the lane has pushed back to the middle of the lane or by your tower. This keeps you relatively safe from ganks while it leaves your opponents overextended and vulnerable to zoning/jungler ganks of your own. League is about finding little advantages and exploiting them. If you know you are wrecking their bot lane, ping mid and roam and take the turret, or keep their blue on a timer (2:08, 7:15, 12:25 are my general timers for blue or keep it warded) and invade their jungle when you push your lane. This creates pressure for your team that other lanes can exploit to their advantage. Or if mid is doing well in addition to your bot lane, force an early fight at dragon (level 6 ish earlier is risky as the dragon actually does a lot of damage). When their team arrives you want to ping the first target for your team to target since they are usually out of position, this also ensures your team stops fighting dragon and takes the free kills served up on a platter for you.

Anyway this is really long but I hope it helps. If you need any additional help add me in-game (obnoxiousplayz or doomster01 on my main).


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smalltx

Senior Member

08-27-2013

Anyone can win and figure out how to play their lane successfully, but I think the aspect of winning a league game that truly separates the good players from the bad is team fighting. If you know how to win a team fight every time, you can usually win the game. Of course there are other factors that come into account after winning a team fight, but this post will be long enough just describing how to win a team fight so I will stick to that for now.

Before the fight
Many team fights are won before they ever start. Here are different aspects that are a MUST to consider if you want to win a team fight.

How many members are present on each team? If you know one enemy is bot lane while your whole team and the rest of the enemy team is top lane, a team fight will go in your favor, as long as you follow everything else coming up. In short, use number advantages whenever possible.

Level Advantage Does your team, for the most part, have a higher lvl on each member than your enemies do? A team fight will go in your favor, as long as you follow everything else coming up.

Health stats Is your team's current HP healthier overall than your enemies? If so, a team fight will go in your favor, as long as you follow everything else coming up.

Available skills How many ultimates does your team have available versus those of your enemies? If the enemy just blew all their ultimates on the support who managed to escape and is now back, and your team has all of their ultimates available, it would be a good idea to team fight. Same thing for regular skill cooldowns, although those have less effect and less of a time window when the skills aren't available.

Now I'm going to talk about positioning and team fight play for each role. If you follow these and do your best to prevent the enemy from doing the same to your team, and follow all of the above considerations, you will win a teamfight.

AD Carry You stay at the back. In low elo, don't listen to your team mates who tell you to focus the other enemy carry only. They are wrong and you can mute them if they scream at you and try to tell you otherwise. Here's why. You want to do the most damage you can. Doing the most damage means staying alive. Staying alive means the enemy team is trying to protect their carry who is at the back, and if you focus their carry, you will die because you have to get too close to every other enemy champion there is who will immediately melt you because you have no defense.
As carry, you shoot whatever is closest to you. If two targets are at the same range, attack whatever is the biggest threat TO YOU. If a tank is attacking you, shoot it. Back away. Shoot it. Back away. Shoot it. Back away. Until the target is dead or running. When the target is dead or running, attack the next closest and next largest threat until they are all dead or running.

Assassin (AP Mid or Jungler, usually) You dive in and get out. You have gap closers. Use them. Kill your squishy target and run like hell. When you are safe, attack the next squishy target you can without dying. And run like hell. Repeat.

Tank/Bruiser You are Volibear. You never die. Your job is to initiate, if you build pure defense. You go in and try to kill a squishy, like an assassin, But wait. Your allied carry is being attacked by a tank or bruiser. Here's where your role is different. Your job is to keep your carry alive. If you see someone attacking your carry, you must attack that target until it is dead or running. Your AD Carry is God. Your AD Carry is the most important thing you have. If it dies, you lose the teamfight. Protect it. Once your carry is safe, go back to trying to kill the enemy carry until it is dead, or you need to turn around to protect your carry again.

Support Depending on what type of support you are, you either stay back with the carry, or dive in like a tank. Mostly you will stay at the back with your carry and provide healing or peeling. Like the tank/bruiser, you must also do whatever you can to keep your carry alive. If an enemy is attacking your carry, do whatever you can to make them stop. Attack that enemy, knock them back, silence them, use whatever skills you have. Keep your carry alive while you do it. Once again, your carry is God. Keep it alive.

During all this, keep in mind one thing. In my opinion, avoid death at all costs. Some players say tanks should fight until death because that means whoever is attacking the tank is not attacking the carry. I think that's wrong, and let me tell you why. If you are alive, even with 50 hp, you can still fight. If you are about to die, run for your life until you are safe. The enemy will either spend valuable time and skills chasing you while they are hacked to death by your teammates, or they will quit and focus someone else. If they go with the second option, just because you are out of the fight, doesn't mean you are out of the fight. Keep a safe distance so that you will not die, but be ready to rush in or use skills at any moment to save your team mates who are still fighting. You are still alive, which means you can still help your team mates or do more damage. If you are nearly dead, just sit back and wait for the right moment to stay alive and go back in to get a kill or save your God. I mean, carry.


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MrSelfDestructt

Junior Member

08-27-2013

Great replies guys, thank you!


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Sycozone1

Junior Member

08-27-2013

Yeah, I was in bronze 2 because of my MMR and self-score, but it seems to be impossible now, I wish Riot can fix this and just put in magma chamber, they're holding that map up and it's starting to aggravate people, especially me.. The bad thing about league is that it requires teamwork, when I even do a duo with a friend ranked-wise, you never know who you're going to be teaming up with, bad players equals a bad game, if only they put in magma chamber 2v2 ranked, it'd be way more fun, easier, less stressful, for everyone, majority of people suck, I don't even deserve to be in the bronze division, people who have a low personal rating shouldn't even be playing ranked, provisional should instead make them play UNTIL they're good enough to compete with others for competitiveness, idc, bring on the hate, Riot said they read the forums, so if they read this one, they should make some changes, additional map, and don't put good teammates with ones who will pull you down... WAY down..


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