A Train's Guide to AP Nasus.

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

HBAFreightTrain

Senior Member

02-10-2013

@Galkrith - Glad you enjoyed the guide. Have fun destroying bots.

Bot games are a good way to practice your Q farming. But it will play a lot different when you play against players. AP Nasus isn't as good in the top lane because most of your matchups will be high sustain bruisers or bruisers with gap closers who go nine pots. So your harass won't wear them down and while you'll get more Q farm, you won't be able to take the top laner. If you're playing top, choose a top laner like Jax or go AD Nasus. If you're playing AP Nasus, you play the mid lane.

Know your strengths and weaknesses. Wither gives you decent protection from ganks but it only stops one. Ranged harass is good but not if you take auto attacks moving in and out. Make them choose between getting CS or shooting you when you use spirit fire. If they fire on you, they are lower on cs and you sustain yourself back with Q with good positioning or pots. If you shove a lane, don't keep pushing it. Do something else. Get the wraiths or gank top. Counterjungle with wards. The ability to quickly push a lane gives you extra time. Use it with a purpose. Going with your jungler to steal the opposing red while the opposing midlaner is collecting cs at his tower is a good example.

Mix it up. Some games you can choose teleport, shove your lanes, and go gank top or bot. You won't get as much CS but you'll have kills to compensate and your team will be ahead as a whole. Some games your opponent will be passive, you'll take the CDR package, you'll freeze the lane with Q farming and happily go into mid game with over three hundred bonus damage on Q. Play your game based on your opponents. Being flexible is a good thing. The goal is to make it to mid-game and late-game as a massive carry to your team and win the game. Do what it takes. If your team isn't tanky, buy that Warmog's early and be that tank. Let the game and the situation dictate how you itemize. This is a guide. It's not written in stone.

Above all, enjoy the game, learn from your mistakes, and be nice to everyone. If you do that, you will not only succeed but you will do so with a cadre of friends and maybe someday, you can be that person on the stage holding that cup with his friends. Good luck and happy hunting. Train.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Galkrith

Junior Member

02-11-2013

Hard to get mid in co-op vs A1 cause everyone wants it but the one match I got mid in I dominated and it was my best match so far


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

HBAFreightTrain

Senior Member

02-14-2013

The buffs went through. The decrease in mana costs is such a huge boost to Nasus.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

acosn

Senior Member

02-14-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by HBAFreightTrain View Post
@acosn - we'll agree to disagree on the value of Warmog's. Most of the LoL community disagrees with your assessment on Warmog's. As for Doran's Ring start, you get away with it due to two things:

1) Nasus has passive life steal - Getting last hits with your weapon gives you health. Getting last hits with Q increases your future damage and gives you more health. So taking a hit occasionally while farming isn't as bad as it is for champions with no life steal.

2) You start with a potion and a biscuit. This means if you screw up, you can heal back 230 damage and still stay in lane.

Also, this build does take Mobility. It's been on the OP as long as this thread has existed.
It doesn't, it says straight up your first item is a doran's. You're a bad liar.

You take no boots, ergo you are not mobile. There's no better way to take a bad situation- your lane gets camped by a jungle, you get counter picked, whatever- than to be a slow ****. While nasus is fairly durable in lane, he's not a god- if anything it's his most vulnerable point in the entire game- and as far as bully oriented characters go he's near the bottom of the list in terms of "can at least do it." Great, grats, you ****ed up someone who didn't know what they were doing.

Warmoggs is not a good value- intentionally designed that way by riot to discourage rushing and stacking them- and anyone arguing otherwise is arguing against statistics. Between resistances, CDR, mobility, and utility there is almost always another tank oriented item that's just better. And most of them won't have their gold value turned on it's head as soon as anyone with a percentage driven damage modifier hits the field.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Pobbes

Senior Member

02-14-2013

@acosn

Wow, calm down a smidge. Just wanted to point at a few things. Train notes that he starts with mobility and a potion because he takes full support masteries. So, he gets the extra forty starting gold for red pot and has 3% bonus move speed. I'ts not as much as boots, but it is more than nothing.

Also, I have used this build twice so far with some success. It does have good sustain and harass in lane. I found it similar to cho. His ult with all that AP is very strong, and with lichbane he still pushes downs turrets in his sleep. It is effective. I suggest you give it a try before you dismiss it.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Shippidi xD

Junior Member

02-15-2013

You should try to fit the new Liandry's and a Rylia's in your build somewhere, they're so amazing on AP Nasus. Your AoE in teamfights will be so amazing that you'll just stare at the enemy and they'll die.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

HBAFreightTrain

Senior Member

02-15-2013

The Q full crits were apparently a bug which makes crit stacking not nearly as good anymore. Rylai's + Liandry's do work well with his E. Apparently the DoTs don't count as DoTs and keep applying the damage/slow. Unsure if that's a bug or a feature. But my initial test agrees with Shippidi's assessment. They are very good.

For now, I'm going to edit it removing the hybrid option and go with the AoE magic health shredding option. With Rod/Ryali's/Liandries/Hourglass, you are very tanky which should make up for lesser damage output.

Thanks everyone for the input and testing. I appreciate it.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Pobbes

Senior Member

02-15-2013

I don't know how I feel about Liandry's and Rylai's. This build was kind of tuned toward that 300 AP mark where Nasus hits a kind of natural cap. He also has all that free AD which I feel gets wasted the more you dump money into AP. So let me make some suggestions. If you want to put Rylai's into the mix, I think you should have it replace the RoA. The price point is similar and the stats are similar minus the mana, but I don't know how major an impact that would have. You'd still hit the 300 ap cap and still have two slots open at end game.

Another possibility is to replace Rylai's with Omen which I think serves the slow function much more efficiently with it's tank stats. Basically, I think if you're not using Rylai's AP as part of your 300 AP equation it's not worth the money. Liandry's I feel fits better because it sits where Doran's ring did once you sell it off.

Also, I like the huge AD burst Nasus gets from his ultimate, and I think you could still find synergy there. Maybe Hydra and Zephyr? The synergy could function well in those places. It's expensive as additional items, but they provide a lot of things Nasus likes but AP Nasus doesn't have. Ghostblade I think could function very well in my mind, but i've never tried it on him. Really for this section I'm just tossing out ideas and seeing if they stick, but I feel there is a direction to go with Hybrid at this point. Nobody else pops an ult and gets over 200 AD. There has to be some better way to take advantage of that than a few auto attacks.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

HBAFreightTrain

Senior Member

02-16-2013

I'm looking at Hybrid options and plan to include it once I get enough testers/tests to verify what is working best for them. Here are some of my thoughts on the matter:

1) You still have to open with Doran's ring + Pot + Biscuit. Otherwise you'll run dry on mana.

2) You still want Merc Treads for Tenacity and MR for the AP mid. Get when needed.

3) You can do Iceborn Gauntlet as your first major item. This will give you enough mana to do your opening and give you a lot of armor. 15% CDR will make Q farming faster and you have a snare.

4) Liandry's Torment allows your E to shred health and makes your E harass more dangerous. It gives you some health and AP.

5) Rabadon's Deathcap will then get you to 325 AP capping your Ult against any health stacking target.

6) The Black Cleaver gives you 50 AD, a little health, armor shred, and 10% more CDR

Cleaver here seems to make sense. You need armor shred so your Qs and extra AD do the proper amount of damage. The CDR allows you to farm Q's faster. And you need more health.

7) Sell Doran's ring, dropping you to roughly 307 AP, for Ravenous Hydra. If the bug still exists (haven't tested this at all), you can Q and if other minions drop from the shared Q damage, you get stacks for all of them. Extra AD and lifesteal with the ability to split push in a hurry.

With only 500 health and some armor/MR, you are going to be a tad on the squishy side. If you're facing an AD mid, this could be nice as you get a lot of armor early with a snare which should help you avoid getting ganked. If someone on your team has bulwark, this might be enough for late game team fights as you'll have an awful lot of armor to shred.

Those are my untested ideas. It seems to me that The Black Cleaver and Ravenous Hydra would give the most bang for the buck for two AD items. Selling boots for a Zephyr in a super long game would make you a little slower but ramps up your auto-attack damage by over 30%.

That's the best I can think of. If anyone wants to test it, let me know how it turns out.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Pobbes

Senior Member

02-16-2013

That actually sounds like a really nice build. I'll see if I can give it a try. I still feel there is something to be had for going Rylai's early to turn your E into an AOE slow over Iceborn as it will apply the liandry's burn more consistently. I want to try a Rylai's>Liandry's>Lichbane>???? this forth item is tough the AP needed is 75 AP which gives the following choices - Morellonomicon, Abyssal, Void Staff, Will of the Ancients. I'm currently leaning toward Abyssal, but then you only have one slot left.. I'm seeing why you went iceborn.

I think you're probably right on this one. I'm gonna try it out.