bad news about the ap yi nerfs

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CaptainAMorgan

Senior Member

01-22-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by bropirate View Post
I hear that's why absolutely no-one plays Poppy anymore and her win-rate is one of the lowest in the game.
Worst early game in exchange for a ridiculous end game.

Yeah, she is horrible, but she has always been able to carry once farmed, it's been that way for more than 2 years.

She wont ever get balanced until that passive of her's is balanced.

Nice way to derail.

Anyways, let's try to discuss AP Yi.


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MerlinCross

Senior Member

01-22-2013

Needed a nerf somewhere. OP where do you suggest he gets it?


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Cookies Morgana

Senior Member

01-22-2013

You can counterplay anyone. Yi's AP ratios, however, are alittle out of hand, even for a channel, and his poke early game could probably take a tiny range nerf, at least for target selection on champions.

Also, he has a 1:1 AP ratio on his Q. It's his only damaging spell, but setting aside the fact that he has a free 70 bonus AD steroid, soft CC reduction (and CD reset) on his ult, those two skills, or at least, especially the heal (considering it's easy to build healthwall as AP. I said easy, not optimal), the 4.0 ap scaling on meditate is absolutely ridiculous.

"use CC on him," you say? Okay. CC does counter him. The issue is, by forcing the enemy team to go more CC heavy champions that are less viable in other aspects of the game and are thus countered by much better comps, CC, in fact, doesn't necessarily counter Yi in high elo play. I mean, it does, but, doing so sort of makes your entire teamcomp suffer. This would be different if 'picking CC shut Yi down completely,' like in Kat's case (who, by the way, had her ult nerfed one rework long ago).

However, it's not. Let's not even mention that in lane (I was typing the above with teamfights in mind tbh), you usually have to put yourself way out of position if you want to interrupt his meditate. I'm sure you don't notice it if you play sloppy and get low enough to use meditate every time it's up because you can, that's why, but that's a perfect bait.


TL;DR

AP Yi's stats need to be toned down a bit, but other than that, he's fine. Also, saying CC counters AP Yi is a strawman argument.


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The Nice Boat

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Senior Member

01-22-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaolla View Post
yeah, getting hit for 400 damage when you're 700 units away from a minion is really fun. it's especially fun when you're 1500 units away from master yi himself

no this character isn't broken at all...
You must **** yourself at Xerath.


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RavageRose

Senior Member

01-22-2013

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...8#post33781028

i have found the solution


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Ogaflow

Senior Member

01-22-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tolfor View Post
Hey OP, please explain to me how having CC stops AP Yi in a 1v1 situation. Because unless you're one of the very few, mostly non-mid champs that has more than one hard CC ability or you're ganging up on him (which invalidates a 1v1 laning situation), you have to choose whether you're going to block his nuke or his full heal. You can't do both by yourself with one stun.

And since "blocking" his nuke will result in him just doing it when the stun wears off instead, your only real choice is to block Meditate, which will at least set off the cooldown and prevent him from using it again right away. Since Meditate heals for silly amounts of HP and raises his defenses considerably, he's still likely to heal at least as much as a health pot before it gets stopped unless your timing is impeccable, and either way, you're still getting hit in the face by that nuke first.

So now you've pretty much got to choose between either not farming to stay safe from his nuke or wading into the minions and praying Alpha Strike doesn't hit you. Even if it doesn't, it's going to blow up all your minions which means you'll now be tanking his, which during early- to mid-game laning can hurt quite a bit.

You can't just wait for him to blow the cooldown on it while farming (and lol, his farm is going to be insane no matter what you do) because it's got such a short one that you won't really be able to do much in between anyway.

If you have a teammate come into help you by ganking him or whatever - good luck, because he's just going to ult out of danger as soon as they show up and get back in your face as soon as they leave. Even if you've somehow got the jump on him in a way he couldn't react to, he can just bust your slows and leave. If it's hard CC? Maybe he's got cleanse, or Mercurial Scimitar, or tenacity, or he's just going to Meditate and heal whatever damage you dealt to him while he was stunned anyway.

Late game in teamfights, he's got his team to protect him while he tanks your whole team with Meditate, allowing him to full-heal and re-enter the fight almost immediately, and he's probably got a Zhonya's Hourglass for further trolling.

So basically, unless your whole team is centered around killing the AP Yi and his team is dumb enough to let you, he's going to be horrible to deal with, and whether or not that happens, he's still going to suck all of the fun out of the laning phase and be more or less unstoppable.

Tell me more about this mystical "counterplay" of yours. And don't give me this "just counterpick him" baloney because not everyone plays ranked or draft mode, and even if they do, as other posters have pointed out, AP Yi can easily be selected after the enemy mid has locked in.
Okay, I have to tear this apart. Granted I am also in favor of the nerfs to AP Yi, but you need to learn how to argue.

The point of having a single hard CC against Yi IS that it lets you counter the meditate. If you are so afraid of 1 Alpha Strike then you have a lot to learn on how to play the mid lane. The trick is to force his hand, you move on him he either a, casts alpha on you which puts him directly in range for your combos or he walks away getting zoned. If you can't trade in a lane against Yi you are either counterpicked or too cowardly and need to step up your aggression. Staying away from Yi is EXACTLY how he wins lanes. Stop playing into his strategies.

Second point, having allies ganking the lane. Why are we even discussing only 1v1 scenarios? Is this not a 5v5 game? Jungle coordination is key to winning games, that includes lane matchups. The enemy jungler will likely try to gank you so you better have a jungler to help you out as well. When you make backhanded comments like only examining 1v1 scenarios it tells me that you have no concept of how this game works.

Third point, you assume Alpha Strike is this insta gib nuke at lv3 to lv6. If you are both full on life and cooldowns you CAN and SHOULD be aggressive. His Alpha Strike at those ranks shouldn't be full clearing the minion wave aside from RNG procs on every single minion, after that he must walk up and melee. You can take full advantage of that if you think rather then fear. Your idea of him always escaping ganks, well why not force him to pop his ult to run. If he comes back in 10 seconds, have your jungler just regank again if he is so bold. The idea of cleanse and scimitar is just silly. If he packs cleanse then your trading is EVEN better because he literally has 1 skill to trade with you. The scimitar.... where do I even begin to attack this hyperbole.... First its an AD item, so AP Yi won't be as painful or healing as well. Second if you let him get that during the laning phase you need to work on your aggression skills.

Fourth point, teamfights then back to laning? Seriously? I agree with you about the teamfights, an AP Yi that didn't get shut down will be a serious problem, but rightfully so considering he would be a farmed/fed champ. But going on again about the lane phase?

Last point, complaining that not everyone sees the Yi pick because of blind mode or Yi coming in as a late draft pick. Blind mode first, it is blind mode for a reason. You pick what you think is best and they do to. It's like Rock-Paper-Scissors. You don't call OP when you pick Scissors and they pick Rock do you? As for draft, the player who last picks AP Yi SHOULD be rewarded for his ingenious strategies no? He worked with his team in champ select or was last pick and on your team, your mid player decided to not work with the team to secure a later pick mid. That isn't Yi's fault, that is the player who let himself be counter picked that hard. Also if he is so bad, you could... I don't know.. Ask for a ban so he is never a problem.

I have given you all the tools I know for how to beat Yi in the lane or deal with him as your opponent somewhere in the game. Your arguments are full of hyperbole and I really got the impression you really don't want to look for an answer and want to save your precious bans for Blitzcrank, Malphite and Darius.


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Bullettime7

Senior Member

01-22-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazyboy0337 View Post
You must **** yourself at Xerath.
Except Yi can deal more damage than Xerath (even when you don't dodge his Q) and wave clear better than Xerath. And Xerath can't full heal in seconds to undo any harassment he took.

And that's the problem with AP Yi atm. He can get high CS numbers from safety, poke from complete safety, and can full heal back. His heal can be shut down in a teamfight but he's a complete and total monster in the early-mid game, able to shrug off any harassment he takes while farming like a champ. Even an early-mid Cho'gath can only be harassed but so much before he has to rethink what he's doing.


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Rivenholt

Senior Member

01-22-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazyboy0337 View Post
You must **** yourself at Xerath.
Yeah, Xerath's pretty over pow- dodged it.

I'm happy to see AP Yi get gimped. For everyone just saying counter pick him, did he have any viability outside of normals to begin with? It's a gimmicky spec that practically plays for you and just feeds off of the opponent not seeing your choice until it's too late in blind pick.

And no, that does not mean "just play draft instead."


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RavageRose

Senior Member

01-22-2013

Akali
Alistar
Amumu
Anivia
Annie
Ashe
Blitzcrank
Brand
Caitlyn
Cassiopeia
Cho'Gath
Corki
Darius
Dr. Mundo
Diana
Draven
Elise
Evelynn
Ezreal
Fiddlesticks
Fiora
Fizz
Galio
Gangplank
Garen
Gragas
Graves
Hecarim
Heimerdinger
Irelia
Janna
Jarvan IV
Jax
Jayce
Karma
Karthus
Kassadin
Katarina
Kayle
Kennen
Kha'Zix
Kog'Maw
LeBlanc
Lee Sin
Leona
Lulu
Lux
Malphite
Malzahar
Maokai
Master Yi
Miss Fortune
Mordekaiser
Morgana
Nami
Nasus
Nautilus
Nidalee
Nocturne
Nunu
Olaf
Orianna
Pantheon
Poppy
Rammus
Renekton
Rengar
Riven
Rumble
Ryze
Sejuani
Shaco
Shen
Shyvana
Singed
Sion
Sivir
Skarner
Sona
Soraka
Swain
Syndra
Talon
Taric
Teemo
Tresh
Tristana
Trundle
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Twisted Fate
Twitch
Udyr
Urgot
Varus
Vayne
Veigar
Vi
Viktor
Vladimir
Volibear
Warwick
Wukong
Xerath
Xin Zhao
Yorick
Ziggs
Zilean
Zyra


Oh lets not forget all these...

Mag res
Armor
Armor pen
life steal
spell vamp
HP
CC items
Wards
AOE items
Hp regen items
Mana regen items
Baron buff
Riot Employees
Nerfs
Buffs
DC's
Riot updates
Riot exploding
Riot going out of business
Riot having a party
New champs
red buff
Blue buff
CDR items
activation item
summoners
passives
Global wars
Wars in general
Weed
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Real Life
Another imaginary life
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Imagination
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My mom
your mom
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everyones mom
immature players
bad players
AFker
DCers
GD forums

how to counter everything in the game. there we all know so no one should QQ about nerfs buffs new champs old champs or anything.