New Item needed, Thornmail is pathetic against lifesteal

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

CaptBonefish

Junior Member

03-05-2013

Lifesteal was always a pain, but now is ridiculous! Since they changed Blade of ruined king IDK why they did it, lol have enough atk spd itens, why they made a atk spd item that gives you high % of lifesteal??

Since riot have created a abomination, they should at least create something to counter it.

My idea:

Thornmail + Giant Belt + 600g = 3800

Stats: 100 AR, 500HP

UNIQUE Passive - Regret: On being hit by basic attacks, returns 40% of damage, before any reductions such as armor, as magic damage over time for the next 4 seconds, while under effect of regret, lifesteal will be reduced to 5%.


Since regret is a new unique passive, it can be stack with thornmail's passive. Now tank and support have a fair chance against adc with Blade of ruined king + BT + BT + Phantom Dancer


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Diabolic Jungler

Senior Member

03-05-2013

The item you described is ridiculously broken. Thornmail counters lifesteal until they get armor pen or get more that 50% lifesteal.

Thornmail returns the damage BEFORE the armor mitigates it. Also lifesteal is off of damage DEALT so they are healing less and doing less damage while you are returning more damage then they heal off of.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Slash7

Senior Member

03-05-2013

thornmail should not be touched since it has the highest armor in the game
and 30% is good number

probably we need another defense items for tanks that reduces healing
but i dont know if that kind of item would be balanced
since carries have almost no protection
what tanks lack is health regeneration
not everyone is garen or mundo

thats why i made a post about buffing executioner's calling
cause 20 atk dmg and 20% crit chance is kinda weak
if it had at least 50 attack damage it would be better

and i think people are rarely buying healing reduction items

so they should buff the healing and healing reduction items


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Rackier

Senior Member

03-05-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptBonefish View Post
Lifesteal was always a pain, but now is ridiculous! Since they changed Blade of ruined king IDK why they did it, lol have enough atk spd itens, why they made a atk spd item that gives you high % of lifesteal??

Since riot have created a abomination, they should at least create something to counter it.

My idea:

Thornmail + Giant Belt + 600g = 3800

Stats: 100 AR, 500HP

UNIQUE Passive - Regret: On being hit by basic attacks, returns 40% of damage, before any reductions such as armor, as magic damage over time for the next 4 seconds, while under effect of regret, lifesteal will be reduced to 5%.


Since regret is a new unique passive, it can be stack with thornmail's passive. Now tank and support have a fair chance against adc with Blade of ruined king + BT + BT + Phantom Dancer
Do you expect to smash ADCs with just one armor item? Get Randuin's or something too. l2pthx


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

JbM07

Junior Member

03-05-2013

Frosen heart, randuins omen
ad carries have it bad enough


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

67chrome

Senior Member

03-05-2013

Right, because reflecting 40-70% of the damage you take (assuming an auto-attacker can penetrate 100% of your armor - which includes at least +200 armor) is totally needed to counter 15% life steal. So is reducing life steal to 5% at the same time.

Thornmail is already super-strong at countering life steal. The only thing that would really make it better is offering the thorns in an aura or aura-like active to counter a few auto-attackers that would rather not focus you, and then it would become pretty much mandatory with such a minor change, even remaining at it's current 30%.

Thornmail already shuts down life steal pretty hard. It reflects 30% of damage pre-mitigation (before armor, blinds, or things like Ninja Tabi are applied). And considering it offers 100 armor on top of that, you're likely reflecting around 60% of the damage you actually take if you grab it as your first item - which is huge, and broken, and only in the game because ADCs tend to farm up 2-3 major items before encountering champions that would typically consider thornmail (if your a melee ADC top lane or running bottom lane in Dominion you're pretty much screwed). Even then, to get thornmail's 30% reflected damage to the point 30% life steal counters it (in that life steal steals no life), the life-stealer needs to get their effective magic resistance (after auras and hostile magic penetration) equal to the armor of whoever is wearing thronmail (after armor penetrations and auras). Considering life steal, armor penetration, and magic resistance are never on the same item - you need at least 3 items to stop killing yourself from thorns. Considering life steal isn't offered at 30% on anything, MR isn't offered at 100 on anything, and Armor Penetration isn't available in the massive amounts needed to shred through thornmail, let alone base scaling as well: realistically you need 4 items - though some times friendly black cleaver stacks or supportive auras can cover enough of that deficit in team-fights or grouping situations. Still, tag anyone reliant on life-steal with Ignite or Morellonomicon and it's more or less inconceivable for them to actually heal off of anyone with thornmail.