Shyvana's State in Season 3

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IonDragonX

Senior Member

02-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnathemaMonstrum View Post
So... I was thinking of picking Shyvana up, is she worth buying currently?
She's a mid power champion, I'd say.
She was the second champ that I learned to play well. Her passive armor/MR used to mean a lot more, before armor pen changed. There might be tweaks in her future but I don't see a rework coming at all.

I still think that the new Blade of the Ruined King will be excellent to rush buy on her.


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I2enegacIe

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Senior Member

02-20-2013

Shyv is much weaker right now.....her main role as a jungle invader doesn't work well if a team wards which is more frequent as people watch the LCS's and such, also jungle camps being reworked hurt aoe junglers, also the meta for jungles is high gankability which she just doesn't have


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XxxKarma

Senior Member

04-30-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by PerfidiousAlbion View Post
(1)Her ability to land a hit hasn't changed.

(2)It's no harder to land than other skill shots. Having a 260 damage 925 range poke is nothing? The fact that it gives her a 40 damage on-hit proc and 15% armor reduction gives it great synergy with the rest of her kit and scaling with AS and damage, but doesn't mean the abilities base effects are bad.

(3)Her ult is a 1000 range gap closer. Her W gives her the speed boost needed to stick to a target.

(4)Shyvanna is no riskier to play than Xin. She has very comparable survivability and a speed boost to escape if need be as well as naturally higher MS. Xin's only option is to ult, and that doesn't even work if he did any AAing first.

(5)Shyvanna does more AoE damage than any of those champions (yes, more AoE than Garen) and is the only one of the lot of them to have a poke.

(6)Her late game scaling has always been one of her high points.
Lets look at your failures here in order:

1: Her ability to land a hit HAS changed - CC and kiting was ALWAYS her achilles heel and it is different, for now its easier than ever with the new items to prevent that making it HARDER to land hits - MYTH BUSTED

2: Her Skill shot does next to no damage and even if it does land it has no beef since it scales off of AP, something getting her is useless on meaning theres no way to scale it HENCE the no scaling part. SURE IT SCALES... with AP. She's an AD champion since nothing she does with AP means anything hence the no scaling. Also if you cant hit them you cant benefit from the armor pen. The on hit proc is fine and the armor debuff is great if point #1 wasn't a problem. Her only presence is Team Fights. Shyvanna's ganks were always an issue. She can move fast but has 0 lockdown meaning if the gankee just has any form of escape or a slow at all they win 9/10 times and since you tried to gank and failed it puts you in a bad place. - MYTH BUSTED

3: Her what? Her ULT is a gap closer? Do you not even realize what you just said? So lets use a directional ult so they can flash or MOVE in ANY direction to avoid you then just kite you. No its not a gap closer its just a way to put her in the fight since she can't really do it herself. Its the same as Nocturn's Ult, its not a gap closer its either a finisher, or an after started fight entrance.

4: Xin has a heal, Attack speed booster, can CC his primary target to do no damage (big monsters) even if its only 1 hit its 1 hit that Shyvanna has to take that he doesn't, He also has a gap closer that slows, appilies a non-skill shot armor reducing ability and does magic damage (non-scaling). He has ALL of these things AND his ult does NOT require an AA to not knockback - he can Charge and it applies his Passive (which by the way is the same as shyvanna's useless fireball's only real benefit but he can maintain it with 0 skill) while also healing per hit. OH!!!! i forgot to mention his Ult does % Max HP damage as well as gives him the same armor boost as her. - MYTH BUSTED

5: No she does not do more aoe than any of those champions unless her ult is out and Garen can stack Damage items and do way more to everyone while silencing you, stacking mix damage and protection, gets a free shield, CC remover and a finishing ult while he gets the same movement speed buff and an out of combat heal. All this means more damage? Yes because if you are alive you can deal more damage. A dead champ deals no damage (unless you are Karthas, Kog'Maw, Zyra... blah blah lol) - MYTH BUSTED

6: Her Late game scaling has ALWAYS been her ONLY point. Her ganks have never been good. No, I know there are MANY champs that are better early game, but early game is where it's always been. If you dont make it to late game what's the point. If you cant get ganks to work before mid-late game, no matter how bad ass you are late game if your team is too weak to keep up cause of your failed ganks and lack of early game, it's meaningless. One player can sometimes snowball out of control but then you probably had the win before the game was started most of the time. This does not generally apply to reasonably decent ranked players and normal games are always a toss up anyways. - MYTH BUSTED


Lastly here goes:
Shyvanna works wonders on high CC teams for ganks. If you are jungle and your top has a reliable stun, slow, fear or some form of good or long CC she does hit farily hard with her Q and her speed lets her get in there and do some decent damage, but if she cant stick to them she can't do much and they get away. I will admit if you get her both a cutlass and exhaust for slows she can do some decent ganks, after that and then get a mallet you are set but until that happens you are going to either only force flashes or they will just stay high hp or ward and walk away from the gank.

She isn't a bad champioin I'm not agreeing with that at all... but she needs some early game. Noc has his fear for a CC. It takes time to use but its something. He also gets a free damage steroid, AS modifier, speed boost, ranged physical damage ability, a spell shield and the same useless non-scaling AP damage ability (the fear's damage). His ult is also the same "gap closer" as mentioned above but works wonders. I can get into MANY other types that can jungle similiar problems as Shyvanna but its pointless as they are all different but work similarly.

Shyvanna's jungle potential is not weak btw it is fine. Get a decent blue or red start and get Q and she can do just fine. Pots and Machette and she works. Machette does not mean you have to level it you can get whatever you want, its the 10 bonus damage plus 10% more damage early game. Dont like that? get an armor or something else. Whining doesnt make her weak, its her lack of jungle presence to lane ganks that makes it difficult. Cant gank? counterjungle. If you can keep THEIR jungler out of the game and prevent HIS ganks you remove a player fom the game as well. If THEIR jungler doesn't have the late game you do and you can shut down their early game you are JUST AS EFFECTIVE and then YOU scale to late game making it a 5 v 4.5 or a 5v4 and turn the tides of battle in your favor.

She does need some gank potential but she does bring a lot to the table if you just play her as intended.

Have fun everyone!


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RomanBowman

Junior Member

05-07-2013

Do you think that having her E slow and either her E or R have a AD scaling would help?
i have seen other peoples opinions and i think this could help her out.


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xXXxSkullkidxXXx

Junior Member

05-09-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by RomanBowman View Post
Do you think that having her E slow and either her E or R have a AD scaling would help?
i have seen other peoples opinions and i think this could help her out.
Having a slow on her e would be nice, but about having the e/r having AD Scaling, I think that it would be nice for it to get scale a bit from ad, that way its not useless to get ap, but personally I think that they need to maybe just go as far as to up her ap scaling, because she is predominately AD focused, but when I have built her in S3 on occasion grab a Rylai's Crystal Scepter, just because if you can stay on them (which is somewhat easy with her w, you can stay up to them, I know others will disagree with the grabbing it but I find with the meta it fits, and if you get liandry's torment you hit them with some percent damage, and that gives you 800 hp land if you add a ravenous hydra and a blade of a ruined king you get some good damage output, and that still leaves her item slots she can fill with more items or 1 and a pair of boots

I know someone somewhere is going to give me some negative response, my point is she just needs to either scale with both AP/AD, or she needs some ability tweaks, I used to play her often but she really can't compare to most other junglers, and top laners


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Leblonjames

Senior Member

05-09-2013

What about a slow on her E ?