Are Champions As Awesome As They Could Be? @Morello @Feralpony @IronStylus @Xypherous

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IGotCareless2

Senior Member

01-24-2013

I like these, they're pretty cool. One problem I have though, is your removal of Hecarim's W. It made thematic sense, as he's not just a centaur- he's the horseman of war. Gaining life from the damage your allies are dealing makes perfect sense, he's gaining power through strife. You focused too much on the fact he's a horseman, and too little on the fact he's the the horseman OF WAR. Overall, these are really cool and make sense. I love what you did to Leona, my favorite champ. It fits her lore much more. I was recently talking to a friend about how I LOVE Leona's kit, and I love her fluff, but there's a total disconnect between the two.


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BestBilbo

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Thresh is awesome by the way guys - just gonna leave this here:

EDIT: ah, picture really small, my bad. Well got some good scores and a 5 winstreak from the get-go.


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BestBilbo

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IGotCareless2 View Post
I like these, they're pretty cool. One problem I have though, is your removal of Hecarim's W. It made thematic sense, as he's not just a centaur- he's the horseman of war. Gaining life from the damage your allies are dealing makes perfect sense, he's gaining power through strife. You focused too much on the fact he's a horseman, and too little on the fact he's the the horseman OF WAR. Overall, these are really cool and make sense. I love what you did to Leona, my favorite champ. It fits her lore much more. I was recently talking to a friend about how I LOVE Leona's kit, and I love her fluff, but there's a total disconnect between the two.
Sure it does make some themetic sense - though I think his current W is more tied to lore rather than appearance, meaning it is less obvious, less readable. On top of that it isn't really an effective ability, it's pretty lackluster.

You still get to charge in and fear stuff with your ghost army behind you however ! As his current ult is pretty dang awesome !

Concerning Leona, she's a tricky one, but the fact that you like it, gonna leave this smiley here:

:)


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ItemsGuy

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IGotCareless2 View Post
I like these, they're pretty cool. One problem I have though, is your removal of Hecarim's W. It made thematic sense, as he's not just a centaur- he's the horseman of war. Gaining life from the damage your allies are dealing makes perfect sense, he's gaining power through strife. You focused too much on the fact he's a horseman, and too little on the fact he's the the horseman OF WAR. Overall, these are really cool and make sense. I love what you did to Leona, my favorite champ. It fits her lore much more. I was recently talking to a friend about how I LOVE Leona's kit, and I love her fluff, but there's a total disconnect between the two.
It doesn't make sense on a visual level--you need to have it explained to you in order to understand it. "What's that fire stuff around him?" You don't know that it heals him every time someone in there takes damage.

It's also hard to account for, on a player's side--you don't ever really feel "rewarded" with it simply because it's hard to distinguish from whether you used it at the "right time" or the "wrong time" due to how inconsistent it can be. I hope this explanation is satisfactory--it wasn't due to thematic issues, but rather gameplay and readability, and that sort of "vagueness" regarding how rewarding it is to use.

Also, I'm glad you like Leona! I know different players like different things, so I want her to be that "ultimate Shield champion"--for players that aren't too huge on fighting (*which also means they can identify with Leona on a personal level, which enriches the experience even more*), but still want to be powerful simply through how well they can protect their allies!


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Mirage Night

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Any ideas on Evelynn? To be her kit does not feel like they one with her theme. She feels disjointed. I'll be honest, her original kit was at least more theme oriented then this new one.


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BestBilbo

Senior Member

01-24-2013

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Originally Posted by Mirage Night View Post
Any ideas on Evelynn? To be her kit does not feel like they one with her theme. She feels disjointed. I'll be honest, her original kit was at least more theme oriented then this new one.
Pretty sure ItemsGuy has something for her aswell - he feels the same way as you.


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Darkomantis

Senior Member

01-24-2013

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Originally Posted by BestBilbo View Post
What I think the problem here is is what Morello has mentioned earlier, if they open a thread like this gathering feedback people will most likely create the illusion that everything they say is valid stuff and Riot are fools to be blamed if they don't listen.

Sure, if people have some good ideas that seriously would make the champion a better champion - the chance you are getting this from someone on these forums is so minor that I guess the reward is not attractive enough compared to the risk Riot would take when asking for feedback, as they would most likely be blamed if they don't listen - even when if it would be entirely justified of Riot to not take the suggestions into consideration.
I understand that it may create an illusion or cause false blames but it's how you approach it that makes it a positive experience overall. Players would have no problem if Riot took their time focusing on one champion at a time to put it in a good spot. You see, I think there is three different results that comes out of a feedback thread which is: problems are being focused on and are fixed, nothing happens because there was misconception that there would be changes, and cast aside due to other priorities.

In the Sejuani feedback thread, you can see that the Rioter doing the thread is only focused on Sejuani and is looking at the suggestions being made and is experimenting changes. That is a type of feedback thread you want where only one champion is being focused on and is known that there will be changes. However, the Viktor feedback thread is a bad type of feedback thread where in my opinion the Rioter gave the misconception that there will be changes but only resulted in nothing. Sure it might have gave good information but starting a feedback thread without setting in hard stone that a champion is going to be changed is what you want to avoid.

If Morello or any other Rioter is avoiding feedback threads on champions because he is afraid of false claims then they need to reevaluate how to properly do one.


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ItemsGuy

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirage Night View Post
Any ideas on Evelynn? To be her kit does not feel like they one with her theme. She feels disjointed. I'll be honest, her original kit was at least more theme oriented then this new one.
I'm taking Eve back to the drawing board in terms of theming--giving her more definition in terms of appearance, theme, all that jazz (making her into a character, instead of just a charicature). The changes are so great, however, that she may as well be a new champion.

I'm taking everything but her ult (which is out of place for her, as the super-satisfying high-speed high-mobility sort of assassin she is)--using "cutting winds" as her core/theming and tailoring an ult to fit that sort of play perfectly and create a unified champion. : )


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BestBilbo

Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkomantis View Post
I understand that it may create an illusion or cause false blames but it's how you approach it that makes it a positive experience overall. Players would have no problem if Riot took their time focusing on one champion at a time to put it in a good spot. You see, I think there is three different results that comes out of a feedback thread which is: problems are being focused on and are fixed, nothing happens because there was misconception that there would be changes, and cast aside due to other priorities.

In the Sejuani feedback thread, you can see that the Rioter doing the thread is only focused on Sejuani and is looking at the suggestions being made and is experimenting changes. That is a type of feedback thread you want where only one champion is being focused on and is known that there will be changes. However, the Viktor feedback thread is a bad type of feedback thread where in my opinion the Rioter gave the misconception that there will be changes but only resulted in nothing. Sure it might have gave good information but starting a feedback thread without setting in hard stone that a champion is going to be changed is what you want to avoid.

If Morello or any other Rioter is avoiding feedback threads on champions because he is afraid of false claims then they need to reevaluate how to properly do one.
If they'd put up a good disclaimer and/or announcement on the actual site that they would start doing this but by no means it would mean all of the ideas would be used - I'd be totally fine with it.

So yeah, obviously, then I'm all up for community feedback. As it's exactly what we are doing here, right now.


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LightningAcorns

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Senior Member

01-24-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggerFish View Post
In all honesty, I think that they need to concentrate less on New champs and more on modernizing OLD champs. Trist/WW/Yi to name some of the biggest offenders.
I'll have to agree on the statement about modernizing. Trist has a bit of a unique flavor to her in that a single kill off the enemy that she is at least involved with can decide life or death for her, or more kills. A few of her flaws are her odd AP scaling abilities, but those are to balance out her having the longest consistent range (level 18) AND the highest AS steroid in the game. Another is that last-hitting will almost always push the lane due to her E. It's strictly unavoidable.
I'm a big fan of Warwick due to the rush I get from playing him. Chasing someone down from across the map is certainly satisfying, and he offers a unique build path. However, his jungling ability is sub-par due to his slow clear time. Yes, he has sustain, but what else? His ganks suck until level 6, he can't clear effectively, and his skills are largely boring. He's about as right-clicky as Yi.
Speaking of Yi, He's currently suffering. For someone with such a sick "katena", he sure does scale heavily with AP. What's even more pathetic is that AP Yi is more viable than his intended role. He needs a serious makeover in order to remain relevant.
I like what they're doing with visual updates, especially on Annie. Tibbers is now one of my favorite designs in League of Legends, but Riot needs to focus a bit more on their actual kits, and changing numbers isn't going to fix that.