Suggestion: Vote to kick in Champion select (ranked solo Q only)

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Saraleet

Junior Member

01-15-2013

Honestly a vote to kick system in champ select would be fantastic. Although I agree with the cons that are presented, right now the only option to deal with a troll like "AD Heimer" is to ask them to dodge (lol,) or dodge yourself and deal with a 30 minute wait even though you've done nothing wrong at all.

Also this would eliminate the need to petition for the tribunal to include pre-game communications since it wouldn't matter anymore. Post-game comms are irrelevant because you can just leave. There is ZERO reason to be subjected to post-game communication unless you voluntarily chose to sta


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gnfnrf

Senior Member

01-15-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yovalord View Post
I want players that are attempting to make other players dodge by not playing the role they were left with, and flat out trolls kicked. Its not a group of people each game being malicious at champion select, its a single person. That is what the "Kick system" would be in place for. While i could be abused in other ways, it would take a majority of malicious players to do so, and the majority of the players on league are not. This isn't a system that is meant to stop players from calling people out for being bad, i never claimed it would. But it would give the option to kick out trolls.
I don't mean to be dismissive of the idea; I'd like to find a way to control champion select better as well.

I just naturally tend to look at a new idea and think "How will this break things?" instead of "How will this help?"

I just look at this and I see a LOT of kick votes called in champion select, and a LOT of arguing about them.

There might be a clever way to tweak it to make it work, though.

A question, while we're chatting about it. Does the lobby dissolve automatically after someone is kicked (as if someone dodged)? I assume so...

Therefore, it's not really a kick vote, is it? It's a "Let's not play this game" vote. Effectively, everyone is kicked. I wonder if that is a better way to think about it.


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Straynar

Senior Member

01-15-2013

I've been talking about this the past few post in here.
A votekick system COULD NOT penalize the kicked or the yes/no voters.
Another option should also be OPT out. Where you can OPT OUT because you can't fill what needs to be filled and the team votes yes/no to let you go also without penalties.

The idea of votekick is honestly to vote to kick an unwanted troll out of your que and basically making them like a didn't want to connect. Allowing you and everyone else to reque, and the kicked party to have to reenter.

There's plenty of people that will play to play but I think the votekick option will alleviate the abusive players in pregame, and an opt out will show people aren't trying to troll and are saying "hey, I can't do this, I don't want to bring everyone down".

This isn't a new concept by far, games have had votekicks in the 90s. Games still run it to get people out of a group either from AFK's, or being bad.


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puppy match

Member

01-15-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Straynar View Post
I've been talking about this the past few post in here.
A votekick system COULD NOT penalize the kicked or the yes/no voters.
Another option should also be OPT out. Where you can OPT OUT because you can't fill what needs to be filled and the team votes yes/no to let you go also without penalties.

The idea of votekick is honestly to vote to kick an unwanted troll out of your que and basically making them like a didn't want to connect. Allowing you and everyone else to reque, and the kicked party to have to reenter.

There's plenty of people that will play to play but I think the votekick option will alleviate the abusive players in pregame, and an opt out will show people aren't trying to troll and are saying "hey, I can't do this, I don't want to bring everyone down".

This isn't a new concept by far, games have had votekicks in the 90s. Games still run it to get people out of a group either from AFK's, or being bad.
Hum, I tends to like the opt out more.
I mean when you start a kick vote, you are effectively targeting another person. It could be seen as an aggression.
However, if you start an opt vote, where you are asking your teammate to "release" you, it feel more friendly and less aggressive.

Of course, after someone get opted out, usually you will be paired with relatively the same group of people for next immediate champion select. So this could be a problem if player 2 opted out cuz player 4 is the troll, and I am still stuck with the troll on next champ select.
My solution would be that after someone opted, you will be put back to queue for at least X seconds before your next match forms. This would allow you to remove yourself from queue to avoid pairing up with the troll...
Only downside is that the troll is still in queue...and become another group of ppl's issue...+_+"
Another downside is that high elo players will need to requeue for another 5~10 minute...

And for those selfish players...nothing changes...for example, I am the selfish player...
"Kick player 3 out, he sucks. If you don't, I will troll you hard!"
VS
"Opt me out, if you don't, I will troll you hard!"
VS
"Player 3 sucks! Player 3 dodge now else I will troll you hard, cuz nothing is in place!"
(+_+" I suck at coming up with troll phrases...it kinda sounded lame...T_T please excuse me on that)

TL;DR:
I think OP's suggestion is great, but change it from kick vote to opt out. IMO, that would be so much better~


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SloshyTempest

Junior Member

01-15-2013

I like the idea, I only joined up to the forums cause I'm sick of this same issue. Unfortunately I don't think anything will change, as to many people defend the current way even though if you read the forums half of it is complaining about trolls during champ select.


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Yovalord

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01-16-2013

[QUOTE=gnfnrf;33515660]
A question, while we're chatting about it. Does the lobby dissolve automatically after someone is kicked (as if someone dodged)? I assume so...
/QUOTE]

Yes, the lobby would disband and you would go back into que at high priority. Thus the reasoning for the 10 minute penalty to who was kicked.


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Yovalord

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01-16-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Straynar View Post
I've been talking about this the past few post in here.
A votekick system COULD NOT penalize the kicked or the yes/no voters.
Another option should also be OPT out. Where you can OPT OUT because you can't fill what needs to be filled and the team votes yes/no to let you go also without penalties.

The idea of votekick is honestly to vote to kick an unwanted troll out of your que and basically making them like a didn't want to connect. Allowing you and everyone else to reque, and the kicked party to have to reenter.

There's plenty of people that will play to play but I think the votekick option will alleviate the abusive players in pregame, and an opt out will show people aren't trying to troll and are saying "hey, I can't do this, I don't want to bring everyone down".

This isn't a new concept by far, games have had votekicks in the 90s. Games still run it to get people out of a group either from AFK's, or being bad.
Let me start with, the original penalty for leaving a ranked game lobby, was an automatic ELO loss. Because of this it made dodging far less common, but it felt so much worse when you had a troll. They switched it to 30 minute penalty because they still wanted it to be significant to dodge. Part of solo Q is that you have 5 random people with different strengths, they DO NOT want people "opting out" until they get a perfect setup and team comp. Without any penalty that would become the situation very quickly.

Its not about kicking players because they don't want to play a role, its about kicking players who WONT play a role they were left with. I agree that votekick could seem aggressive, but you aren't using it against the guy who saying "I ll fill any role, gl hf guys!". You are using it against the "Mid or feed DGAF" player. And in that situation the chat with the current system already has the same level of aggression if not more.


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Yovalord

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01-16-2013

bump


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vortical42

Senior Member

01-16-2013

I agrre with some of the others here that making a penalty of the kicked person is going to invite abuse. However, there is a way to work around the issue. Instead of voting to kick a player, change it to voting to dodge. Then you spread the penalty out evenly between all the players who voted to leave. Your vote status would be visible only to you and you would be free to change it any time.

If there are any yes votes at the end of the final waiting period, everyone returns to the queue, and the penalty is divided evenly between everyone who votes yes. If the vote was unanimous, there is no penalty for anyone.

This system would solve the champ selection trolling without be open to abuse the way a kick vote would. What do you think?


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AlyCat103

Senior Member

01-16-2013

your suggestion is a band aid fix to pregame toxicity/bullying.
Ideally players shouldn't behave this way in because they can/will face punishment for it. Because it doesn't show in tribunal (and everyone knows that) it continues.

Players should be able to report others in pre game lobby, for that chat content. Because of complications that's a easier said then done.
(maybe it would be easier if riot just made it so when you report a player in pregame lobby, just that chat gets sent. If you want to report them for the in game chat, you report them at the end of the game. simpler? I'm not sure.)

Until then - take a screen shot and send it into player support. On behalf of the rest of us, please it sucks that it happened to you (or at all) but for the time being, more players need to do this (manually report pregame toxicity) to stop players from thinking there's no consequence to toxic behavior in pregame chat.

Well I can understand your point of view, and what your intentions are, I don't think it's a good solution. I'm going to go out on a limb here (forgive me) to say that - at your elo (diamond) this is probably a more black and white issue. But at lower elo's where the majority of players in ranked are - this can easily punish innocent players.
At 2k elo a player picking heimer with clarity, barrier when your team needs an adcarry - well that's a troll (my assumption - I don't play at that level).
But - at 1200 elo that might not be a troll. Unless otherwise suggested, that's probably just a player who just started ranked, only plays heimer, and is on there way to 600 elo. (I have experienced this numerous times in the 1200-1300 elo placement matches).

Your system means they probably would never get to play, they would constantly get kicked from games, and they don't deserve it. Your suggestion being implemented would make lower elo games worse.

While I understand the intention is to stop players from bullying their teammates in champ select (which happens at all elo's I'm sure) it is going to be abused at lower elo's, when players don't follow the meta (which isn't necessary to win games at that elo anyways) and kick players who have unconventional picks/non-"god tier" champs.