Nerf Amumu ap scaling or buff Leona's ap scaling

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Keitterman

Senior Member

01-10-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinker 10 View Post
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Edit: sidenote, Lilballz favorite jungle champion is amumu. So why did he jungle Mundo in world championships? Because he had a better chance of winning, as mundo is actually HARDER to shut down in the jungle.
Um, mundo and amumu are so different, that I would say he brought Mundo because of team comp, not because one is singularly more effective than the other.


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Pinker 10

Senior Member

01-10-2013

Really? steal mundo's red, then steal Amumu's blue. which one is hurt more?


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Acanthus

Senior Member

01-10-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJester View Post
Her ap scaling is sad. 30% for shield of daybreak, 40% for eclipse, another 40% for zenith blade, and 80% for her ult. Do you see the comparison on the 2 "Tanks"?
First of all, her q has a low ap ratio because it's an auto attack enhancement, meaning it has a 30% ap ratio and a 100% ad ratio when you actually use it. The damage is not that bad, considering you're also stunning. Secondly, her eclipse is a massive defense steroid, not just a damage tool. Her e is a snare. Her r is an aoe stun/super-slow. My advice to you, if you want her to do damage, get either trinity force or frozen fist (Frozen fist is cheaper, gives some nice armor, and gives her some much needed cdr, Trinity Force synergizes better with her kit overall due to the fact that its slows aren't wasted on her q, but is generally too expensive to get if you aren't ahead). Beyond that, I would probably not get more than Wits End and/or Abyssal Scepter for offense, and them only because they add to her defense. Would definitely get Randuin's Omen as soon as I could because Leona needs hp.

Leona, as she is, will not be optimal offensively because her sunlight is only procced by ally champions, but that doesn't mean you have to be helpless. With her amount of cc, you could probably kite another melee champion in top with the itemization for it. And in team fights, your cc will destroy them all the same.


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Aringhe

Senior Member

01-10-2013

I'm sensing a strange similarity with Amumu and Morgana here... CC skill shot? Yep. AoE ult? Yep. AoE DoT? Yep. Perma-banned? Yep. Wow, now if only people realized how gimpy Amumu is mid game if he's not fed, just like Morgana. Na, that won't happen, easier to nerf them.

I think Leona needs a QoL change, not a flat buff. I also don't see how buffing Leona somehow makes Amumu 'balanced', if you think he's overpowered right now.


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Vencu

Senior Member

01-10-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peligrad View Post
Surrender at 20 has absolutely no note of this.

Link or it didn't happen...
http://www.reignofgaming.net/news/22...hampion-thresh


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Peligrad

Senior Member

01-10-2013

Um...pretty sure that's a typo.

They announce the amumu change on the 3rd and then Thresh on the 7th. Then just a week later undo exactly what they did and announce thresh on RoG without Surrenderat20 knowing anything about it?

Not likely...its just RoG being disorganized and slow....as usual.


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Vencu

Senior Member

01-10-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peligrad View Post
Um...pretty sure that's a typo.

They announce the amumu change on the 3rd and then Thresh on the 7th. Then just a week later undo exactly what they did and announce thresh on RoG without Surrenderat20 knowing anything about it?

Not likely...its just RoG being disorganized and slow....as usual.
LOL i provide proof and you say it's wrong, ok i'll even go on pbe for ya and get a screenshot

also note that it even says it didn't stop AA's in the old client and they had a patch note where the change happened, riot can change their mind on something in 4 days if they thought it was risky to begin with


fresh from the pbe

http://i.imgur.com/iyoRq.jpg

also surrender20 did have notes on it http://www.surrenderat20.net/2013/01/17-pbe-update.html


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Dark Kuno

Senior Member

01-10-2013

Comparing Leona's ratios to other champs is really not helpful in getting the true problem with her fixed.

Leona's AP ratios is so poor because her passive's damage is a factor of her kit balancing. The problem is that she has no access to that damage. Her ratios are fine in and of themselves. She just needs to be given access in some form to her passive's damage to be equal to the other champs in terms of personal performance.


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Sir Tiddles

Senior Member

01-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Kuno View Post
Comparing Leona's ratios to other champs is really not helpful in getting the true problem with her fixed.

Leona's AP ratios is so poor because her passive's damage is a factor of her kit balancing. The problem is that she has no access to that damage. Her ratios are fine in and of themselves. She just needs to be given access in some form to her passive's damage to be equal to the other champs in terms of personal performance.
I think this is the crux of her solo problems and why she can't jungle very well. There was a thread a while back including red posts that talked about Leona's passive, but I think they said they wanted to keep her not proccing that damage. The more favorable change if I remember correctly was to stack the passive procs so that if Leona's spells land one after another before an ally's to proc the damage, that you wouldn't lose an proc in the process.

Riot seems to be very hesitant to let Leona proc her own passive or increase her AP ratios. I have to say that I kind of agree with this, because if it ever gets to a point where Leona is dealing solid damage then nobody would ever play anyone else due to the sheer amount of CC and control she brings.

I would still like to see her able to to jungle like other tanks, but the idea of Leona ganks coming from the jungle at any point are a little bit scary. A dash-root followed by a stun would basically insure a kill. Perhaps they could let her proc her own passive against minions and jungle creeps but not other champions?


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Dark Kuno

Senior Member

01-11-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Tiddles View Post
I think this is the crux of her solo problems and why she can't jungle very well. There was a thread a while back including red posts that talked about Leona's passive, but I think they said they wanted to keep her not proccing that damage. The more favorable change if I remember correctly was to stack the passive procs so that if Leona's spells land one after another before an ally's to proc the damage, that you wouldn't lose an proc in the process.
That still won't actually fix anything since she wouldn't be able to access the damage of her passive and therefore would still not be able to perform as a solo. Its not having access to her passive's damage that is keeping her from being able to solo like every other champ in the game, not any potential lost procs from her teammates.

Quote:
Riot seems to be very hesitant to let Leona proc her own passive or increase her AP ratios. I have to say that I kind of agree with this, because if it ever gets to a point where Leona is dealing solid damage then nobody would ever play anyone else due to the sheer amount of CC and control she brings.
She doesn't have to be able to actually proc her passive, but she needs access to it's damage in some form. Even if it is a Dot that would deal its damage over the course of the duration until popped by an ally.

And regarding the amount of CC she has, Naut has more CC than Leona by a country mile, and is vastly more survivable, deals significantly more damage and can function as a solo.

Quote:
I would still like to see her able to to jungle like other tanks, but the idea of Leona ganks coming from the jungle at any point are a little bit scary. A dash-root followed by a stun would basically insure a kill.
An E+Q combo from Leona has the same duration as an Amumu Bandage Toss by itself. It's less effective than a Naught Q+autoattack.

Leona's kit would mazke her a great jungler don't get me wrong, but people drastically overestimate her CC's actual duration.

Quote:
Perhaps they could let her proc her own passive against minions and jungle creeps but not other champions?
Which again would mean she wouldn't be viable as a solo because she wouldn't be able to effectively duel or kill her lane opponent since she would go in with an automatic handicap by not having PvP access to 50% of her damage. And without any sustain a standard bruiser would simply out damage her and either kill her repeatedly, or push her out of lane constantly. Both of which would render her mostly useless in the mid-late game.