BFT needs limitations on how effective it is with different types of damaging spells

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General Quackers

Senior Member

01-08-2013

5% max health as magic damage at all times regardless of the spell is crazy. Single target spells and skill shots should apply the full damage. However, having AoE spells and toggle spells apply the full 5% magic damage is insane damage. Amumu, Singed, and Anivia are examples of champs who take the BFT passive to extreme levels of damage.

AoE spells in general should not apply the full 5% to all targets hit, that's crazy amounts of power and incredibly easy to abuse. I also think that toggle AoE toggle spells need to be looked at specially because the synergy there with BFT easily becomes overwhelming. Amumu is a great example of a champion who completely upsets the balance of power once he finishes a BFT, in a group fight, he easily ends up pumping out the more damage than the AP carry by virtue of an AoE kit + damage aura toggle + BFT.

I understand that the charge system is in place to limit how long an AoE ability can keep the BFT passive rolling, but I'm telling you that even in a 5v5 fight, the battle is decided before all 18 charges get eaten away.


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Infirc

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Senior Member

01-08-2013

it's 5% of Max health over 3 seconds, it's not at any time, it's 1.75% of Max health per Second.

Nice try man but not factual enough, try again and good luck!


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Warrrrax

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Senior Member

01-08-2013

Sadly, BFT is the 1-size-fits-all OP option to make AP champs more viable. Same with wooglets.

They should have simply made it like Liandrys, where AoE and DOTS have half value. That would have fixed many of the issues without requiring Teemo nerfs, etc.


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MyDeadGrandma

Senior Member

01-08-2013

It
is
not
the
damned
passive
that
is
the
issue


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trustmeimdoctor

Senior Member

01-08-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by MyDeadGrandma View Post
It
is
not
the
damned
passive
that
is
the
issue
I think it's a large part of the issue. I know the AP, magic pen, health, and CDR, certainly make it a better deal, but that passive does really hurt.


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Ikruti

Senior Member

01-08-2013

The scaling on Amumu's W is 1.5% / 1.8% / 2.1% / 2.4% / 2.7% (+ 1% per 100 AP). That makes the passive worth 175 AP on him. Or looking at it another way (assuming no more bonus flat damage added) it's worth another 5.83 ranks of his W.

If people think Amumu's W is good as is, at least in the case of Amumu, that seems like the passive is extremely powerful.

Not saying the passive is overall the issue with the BFT but I can see a case where it becomes extremely powerful with certain champs, which I believe is what the OP was talking about, specific champions instead of AP champs overall.

Or put another way, the argument of the passive isn't problem means that if you had BFT without the passive DOT, these champs would still be a problem. Which may be true, but I think it's hard to say the passive doesn't at minimum contribute significantly to the issue.


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Nyx87

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Senior Member

01-08-2013

BFT is strong, but for a few more reasons than just the passive. On top of its passive, it's a giant stat stick giving AP, HP, CDR, and Mpen for a fairly cheap price. For 2950 it gives casters everything they want damage-wise. It's a bargain compared to something like Deathfire Grasp which costs 3000 and only gives AP, CDR, and an Active

Let's Compare the 2 shall we? Let's do some math crafting here. First, it's 3.5% over 2 seconds now, so thats 1.75% every second/charge on BFT. Lets say you blow all of your charges at once on a single target dealing full damage, thats 31.5% of their max HP(realistically this takes 18 seconds to achieve but we are simplifying things). DFG only gives you 15% but has the added bonus of the damage increase(which is hard to weigh). DFG has a cooldown of 60 seconds. It takes 27 seconds for BFT to fully charge itself.

Now, DFG does have 30 more AP and 5% more CDR, while BFT grants 15 Mpen and 250 HP which DFG has none of, yet DFG costs 50 more gold. SO, if you were to ask me, which you did by posting in a public forum , BFT is just too cost efficient for what it does and needs a stat change, not just a tweak to its passive.


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Orphane

Senior Member

01-08-2013

Guess what, BFT is getting a recipe mixup and becoming a 3.8k cost item!


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KaWraith

Senior Member

01-08-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Orphane View Post
Guess what, BFT is getting a recipe mixup and becoming a 3.8k cost item!
yes, but it will be even more slot efficient, and well worth extra gold. the rework just moves the passive to later in the game (when people have more hp and it does more dps anyway.) but It will also still build out of useful caster items.


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Phourc

Senior Member

01-08-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by KaWraith View Post
yes, but it will be even more slot efficient, and well worth extra gold. the rework just moves the passive to later in the game (when people have more hp and it does more dps anyway.) but It will also still build out of useful caster items.
What're the new stats? ****-ton of AP?


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