So I can't bot-Jax...

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Phourc

Senior Member

01-07-2013

So consensus is I don't suck massive amounts (yay!), should I have just asked to switch out when I saw my matchup or could I have pulled it off by playing conservatively enough?


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konfetarius

Senior Member

01-07-2013

Err. Jax beats Teemo and Vayne, albeit it takes proper execution (you will need to clear shrooms; and Vayne outscales/kites you if you don't get enough CDR and properly time your late game leap-->wait-->E--leap combo).

Teemo normally screws over melee auto attackers, but Jax does significant amount of damage in abilities and his E reduces damage from both shrooms and Teemo E. As long as you don't walk into pre-placed shrooms, you just flat out kill him (can't really avoid steeping into a shroom Teemo puts down unless your reflexes for hitting it are really good; and even then Blind stops you from killing the shroom).

Vayne, just get Lantern and her only realistic way to kill you for vast majority of the game outside wallstuns is gone. Late game she does enough damage in that if she condemns you away when you try to leap in with Q/E you will probably die, but that's why you get high CDR in this lane. Because you leap on Vayne to negate her range advantage, your combined (better balanced) offensive/defensive steroids allow you to kill her before she kills you (especially true if you ready your passive on minions). Her only real option is to condemn you away immediately, then she has about 2 seconds to kill you before you turn on your E. If Vayne can kill you in 2 those seconds, you probably forgot to turn on your ultimate. If she survives a second leap with a stun attached to it, you built Jax wrong.

SInged, I haven't played that lane in forever, nor probably against a decent singed. If need be, you can chase a Singed down with a Jax, so it becomes a question of whenever you farm better than him. Try to use you E to control relic (he def has advantage there with 2 ways to stop you from reaching relic, but hey, what can you do? Get ton of life leach and pick up the relic from your point. At the very least you can hold your tower indefinitely while free farming). I don't know if BFT gives Singed enough power to win outright kill Jax mid-game.


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inFe eD

Senior Member

01-07-2013

^ is bad and loses every single lane. I wouldn't trust his judgement in... well... anything!

Jax really should beat Teemo and Vayne, though.


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konfetarius

Senior Member

01-07-2013

Sigh. Next Saturday you are staying bot lane the whole tourney and you will like it.


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SLayerOfNOOB

Senior Member

01-07-2013

against vayne i think what you need to do is build phage and movement speed early, and level your jump as a priority. If she can't kite you, you win. The decreased CD on jump from levelling should help.

ALSO - maybe try and bait her condemn, get her to use it too early? like, rush at her (without jumping), she condemns you away, then you jump straight at her- (flash then jump if needed) and smash her until either her condemn goes off CD or she dies. If she knocks you back while your jump is on CD you are kinda screwed.


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konfetarius

Senior Member

01-07-2013

Okey nevermind, minion mastery nerf means you can't herpaderp clear minions in front of tower early as melee. Singed was hard before but now it's probably impossible unless you switch bot after you have items.


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SlasherBag

Senior Member

01-07-2013

I would say singed would be the hardest mu of those three you listed. The vayne one shouldn't really be an issue if you get a semi early lantern, at that point just ask for ganks and you'll force a swap if you don't straight up beat her on your own. qss for teemo and you're golden, and the best part is it upgrades now too.

For singed, I used to beat him with melee bots by getting two vamp scepters. While thats not the best option anymore, I think it might work if you're starved for creep and not getting ganks. On the plus side it'll upgrade into grez which is still a good buy, and sanguine.


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Eloquid

Senior Member

01-07-2013

I'm not sure if this helps, but I'll tell you my Singed perspective since he is my main. A little story first. The other day I managed to kill set of Mundo (!) and Talon, three times, going at me at botom lane. First two times I huged turret and just flinged them around my capture point that hit them to death. The third time was incredibly stupid because I couldn't survive their third stubborn attack so went to base and they chased, of course. At the entrance I just flinged Talon and laser killed him, Mundo couldn't believe and went after me and laser killed him too. I guess they couldn't believe one champs could fvuck with the other two so much, repeatedly.
So, the point? Don't try to remove Singed from capture point if you know he's there. It's waste of time. Just ignore him and go somewhere else. The best you can do is try to deny him farm because he's crazy good at that. If I'm Singed and you're Jax hugging your turret, I can't do anything to you except annoy you with flinging you from the turret. And of course, if you're not noob that'll chase me after that, then I will kill you eventually if you're stubborn enough and don't get help from your teammates. Just go back to the turret, which hurts me more than you because turret starts hitting me. And never, ever chase singed, no matter how low on health if you're low on hp too. He'll just turn around and fling you in his poison and you're dead. I hope this helps.
And, somebody theorized if Jax outfarms Singed. No. Nobody outfarms Singed. He passively kills every minion while on the go.


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Xavderion

Senior Member

01-07-2013

Jax should be able to keep up with Teemo and Vayne. But Singed? Not happening bro.


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Talith PA

Senior Member

01-07-2013

There is no reason a Riven should ever beat a Jax in lane.


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