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Zileas' List of Game Design Anti-Patterns

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Hanni

Senior Member

11-10-2010

Quote:
Zileas:
There are difficult champions. An alternative view is that maybe this game has become popular because it is accessible, while still having a lot of depth.


Lately, difficult champions are labeled as bad. Just because they aren't as "fun" as MF (still don't understand how you can price MF at 6300 and Lux at 3150), doesn't mean they are as bad as some people think they are.


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SonicTheHedgedawg

Senior Member

11-10-2010

Quote:
SonicTheHedgedawg:

Also I find a particular item to violate the "Flase Choice/Deceptive Choice" anti-pattern:

MADRED'S BLOODRAZORS
- Do you build Armour? You won't mitigate the %-based damage passive at all.
- Do you build Magic Resitance? Well, the attack speed/attack damage component on the phys carry will murder you.
-Do you build Hit-Points? Well if you do that, you'll mitigate both the passive and the direct damage a little, but the passive scales with HP, so that's not really a good option either. And if, somehow, that turns out to be the most cost-effective option, there's no way most people would know that off the top of their head when the item is an ANTI-HP item.


I think the best option probably varies depending on what other items you and the bloodrazor character has, but it's really not feasable to run the numbers while in-game.


please Zileas. Can you explain this to me how this item doesn't violate that anti pattern? Or how Mana Regen/Level runes aren't way too good compared to, say, energy regen/level?


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BACKSTABUUU

Recruiter

11-10-2010

Zileas, I regret to inform you that this thread is now gravely incorrect, as Earthworm Jim easily falls under the **** the player category.

This implies that you have no respect for the creators of Earthworm Jim, and we both know that's illogical.


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Kithas48

Senior Member

11-10-2010

its like checkers
the rules? easy as ****
the character classes? oh so easy
is it hard? that scales directly with your opponnent


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Viro Melchior

Recruiter

11-11-2010

Quote:
Zileas:
Its kludgey to put that srot of restriction. However, I agree that exhaust may be a bit much in its present design.


As someone who has played extensively as Yi recently, as well as vs carries, and as Teemo....

Here is a proposed change to Exhaust:

Current iteration: Blinds the target (100% miss chance), and slows it's Movement Speed by 40% for 3 seconds.

Current mastery: Increases duration by .5 seconds (to 3.5), and also debuffs armor and magic resist by 10 for the duration.

Updated iteration A: Blinds the target (50% miss chance), and slows it's Movement Speed by 25% for 6 seconds.
Updated iteration B: Weakens the target (deals 50% reduced physical damage), and slows it's Movement Speed by 25% for 6 seconds.

Updated mastery: Increases duration by 1 second (to 7), and also debuffs armor and magic resist by 10 for the duration.


Result:
  • Iteration A simply scales down the blind severity. This means that chain-blind no longer completely shuts down an auto-attack champion. It drops your damage by about 50%, subject to the whim of the RNG God.
  • Iteration B takes a new approach to the concept, and avoids the RNG factor entirely. In addition, it also better counters less auto-attack reliant physical attackers (such as Xin Zhao and Pantheon) by dropping the damage (but not preventing the ability side effects).
  • Both Iterations double the duration due to the drop in raw power, which serves as a buff to the slow. So the slow % is toned down while getting the benefit of the increased duration. Finally, the mastery is adjusted to have double duration. The bonus -10 armor/MR is a relatively minor modifier, and not worth halving due to the longer duration, and is simply an improvement to the mastery.
Either way, the focus of the spell becomes a longer duration partial disable, instead of a short duration total disable (against certain champions). No matter what, this would allow physical carries to be somewhat effective despite a summoner spell (I mean, casters, how much would you enjoy "Silenced and Slowed" summoner spell?), while keeping the numbers balance in place.

And as a side effect, Iteration B would open the door for an identically themed anti-caster spell (causing them to deal 50% magic damage for 6 seconds, along with some other globally-useful effect).


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CovertGhoul

Senior Member

11-11-2010

Quote:
Zileas:
well, we are removing flash



woah


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IS1f1d52ece4eba8be33817

Senior Member

11-11-2010

How about Cho'gath ultimate?
You want use it on creeps as it give guaranteed stack, but you also want to use it on champions, because it deal massive dmg, however this way you aren't guaranteed to gain stacks. Players mostly use it just to get bonus hp, eventually they use ult to steal kills.

I'd say that cho's feast should give stacks on use, instead of killing blow with it.
(You take big nomnomnom and it doesn't matter which part you ate, 50kilo of flesh is 50kilo of flesh. Cho isn't a gourmet, except Gentleman.)


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Shwab

Senior Member

11-11-2010

Bump for justice


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Clarithium

Senior Member

11-11-2010

I hate this thread


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Lightstriker

Recruiter

11-11-2010

Quote:
BJSV:
I dont like this.

Maybe thats why there arent any difficult champions in LoL. Its all so beginner friendly and later on it looks like you are stuck in endless tutorial.


The one thing I've noticed is that almost everyone who says this has *****ed at some point within the previous 6 hours about how bad all their allies are.

Just saying.
Quote:
Bargaw:
How about Cho'gath ultimate?
You want use it on creeps as it give guaranteed stack, but you also want to use it on champions, because it deal massive dmg, however this way you aren't guaranteed to gain stacks. Players mostly use it just to get bonus hp, eventually they use ult to steal kills.

I'd say that cho's feast should give stacks on use, instead of killing blow with it.
(You take big nomnomnom and it doesn't matter which part you ate, 50kilo of flesh is 50kilo of flesh. Cho isn't a gourmet, except Gentleman.)


The trade off is pretty clear actually. you feast creeps for stacks, and just use it for damage in fights.