Zileas' List of Game Design Anti-Patterns

First Riot Post
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MrHaveANiceDay

Senior Member

07-14-2011

Zil, I'm an English major and the video game industry is something I'd love to get into after I graduate. What kind of degree or hands-on knowledge does Riot or other game studios look for in new interns/hires?


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Oberic

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Senior Member

07-14-2011

Have you considered fixing Locket and adding it back in, changed to be along the lines of the "Nome's Wisdom" item from HoN?

Sorry if this is the wrong place to ask this. :/


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Zileas

VP of Game Design

07-14-2011
252 of 282 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrHaveANiceDay View Post
Zil, I'm an English major and the video game industry is something I'd love to get into after I graduate. What kind of degree or hands-on knowledge does Riot or other game studios look for in new interns/hires?
Well, it depends on the group. You should take a look at the job descriptions, but in general, we like really smart people who take feedback gracefully and are thoughtful, and have a demonstrated passion for the job function in question.


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IcanTankasTF

Senior Member

07-14-2011

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...=969430&page=2

Zileas please read the OP, it is in regards to a post you made on Sirlin years ago.


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biff10426

Senior Member

07-14-2011

Really? Rupture? Burden of Knowledge? Rofl.

*gets hit with Rupture, doesnt know what it does, runs away and dies*

"Wow wtf was that?"

"oh, he puts some dot on you that ticks if you move"

"Ah, lol"

Wow that took forever, we really dont need skills like that in the game, at all. TOO HARD TO UNDERSTAND!


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MrHaveANiceDay

Senior Member

07-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zileas View Post
Well, it depends on the group. You should take a look at the job descriptions, but in general, we like really smart people who take feedback gracefully and are thoughtful, and have a demonstrated passion for the job function in question.
Thanks. As something of a writer, I'd lean more towards the design aspect...anything from abilities, backgrounds, lore, worldbuilding, etc.


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Risoluto

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Junior Member

07-14-2011

After reading the initial post and agreeing with most points, there's only one thing that bothers me, even if it is pretty far off topic. In your section "Or We Could **** the Player!!1111oneoneone," you frown upon implementing game mechanics that intentionally mock or make the game one sided against the player. I agree that these are poor design choices...if the target audience is everyone. I noticed that some of the examples you used in that section are from somewhat niche games. I'm fairly certain that Bayonetta was tailor-made to action game enthusiasts, and those types of players tend to shoot for the highest rank from what I understand. While something like a stone rank might be insulting to some players, it might also be a wake-up call to players who are experienced in those types of games, which is (again) the game's target audience. I'm not familiar with D&D, but the tomb of horrors concept sounds like pretty much every encounter in most roguelikes, which also have their own set of fans.

I realize your post was just under a year old, but I believe the possibility that intentionally screwing over the player can be a good design choice if it's ok with your target audience. This can also be used to explain why so many supposed breakout games flop, simply because a designer is trying to appeal to both everybody and an individual audience at once, meaning the game's creators cannot make choices that will be fine with absolutely everybody.

This is just a loose opinion of mine. Hell, there might be some gaping hole in those last two paragraphs that might force me to bite my tongue, but I felt compelled to throw my two cents out there.
I hope that perhaps it won't fall on deaf ears or that somebody may tell me otherwise.

Edit: Obviously none of this holds true for multiplayer gaming, which should have fair play and a competitive nature by default


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Xenodyne

Senior Member

07-14-2011

Thanks for the post! Very informative way to put it. I'll be sure to put this to good use in the future!


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KusAchtak

Senior Member

07-14-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zileas View Post
Yes, good UI reinforcement and art and so forth can reduce this burden. But some abilities still will have it a lot, and some will have it a little bit. It's a set of trade-offs... but some ways of doing things ARE just better.
The abilities tab in the "champion profile" in the pvp.net client *still* do not contain the hero's passive ability or any numbers at all (damage, healing scaling, slow%, etc). Why? I see no logical reason whatsoever for this at all. Just none.

How is someone supposed to get that vital information? Do you at Riot suppose all players go on the website? The forums?
Even if so, a quick look at the champions learning center shows that you haven't even added Oriana yet!
Basically, you at Riot offer NO PLACE to learn of the 3 latest heroes' numbers other than in-game. Makes no sense whatsoever. Burden of knowledge with no where to get that knowledge.


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Quantris

Junior Member

07-14-2011

Quote:
Non-Reliability
Skills are tools. Players count on them to do a job. When a skill is highly unreliable, we have to overpower it to make it 'satisfying enough'. Let me give you an example: Let's say Kayle's targeted invulnerability ult had a 95% chance of working, and a 5% chance of doing nothing when cast. We'd have to make it a LOT stronger to make it 'good enough' because you could not rely upon it... and it would be a lot less fun. Random abilities have this problem on reliability -- they tend to be a lot less satisfying, so you have to overpower them a lot more. Small amounts of randomness can add excitement and drama, but it has a lot of downsides. There are other examples of non-reliability, but randomness is the most obvious one. Abilities that require peculiar situations to do their jobs tend to run into the same problems, such as Tryndamere's shout that only slows when targets are facing away from him.
.....Dodge?

Asking this in a serious way, not QQ. Just wondering what you thought on it in how it fits into LoL? Reason I ask is I remember something about Riot wanting to take dodge out. Might of been a rumor for all I know or some random post I skimmed over.