The one thing that DotA has that League doesn't

First Riot Post
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Feluu

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Itemization at this point is too much for this game. Theres over a hundred champions. If you give more abilities to champions obviously some champions will utilize that ability a lot more and better than others. How would you be able to balance that? That will just completely **** up the game.


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Fishous

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpt Knuckles View Post
Not necessarily true. While I may not be able to get my point across in the sleepless state that I'm in, stat stacking is not a prerequisite of itemization. That is to say, more items are situational than not. While more Axe players tend to build STR, it's still hilarious to build Int for Agh.Scep., for an example, and while I don't want to go through the list of heroes and clarify the different ways they can be built, I can safely say that itemization is dependent on the situation. And yes, DEX heroes do build satanic for that neat lifesteal bonus. STR heroes can build INT. AGI Rubick is best.
"While I don't agree with you because you're wrong, I can't actually think of a reason why."


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Cpt Knuckles

Senior Member

12-19-2012

What a constructive post!


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Zombie Horze

Senior Member

12-19-2012

I have not read this thread all the way through and for that I apologize if this has been mentioned, but could we get a pause feature? Its obnoxious not being able to pause for a few minutes when a teammate disconnects or you have to do something really fast.


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Xpyder

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Senior Member

12-19-2012

I'd like to point out one thing... while in league, items mostly enhance ur champion's abilites(instead of giving you completely new ones or greatly changing one of yours), in dota, in many cases, ur Hero BECOMES his items + his C/C late game... Im glad this doesnt happen in league, you cant buyt some stuff and change ur champion into the sum of his items...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie Horze View Post
I have not read this thread all the way through and for that I apologize if this has been mentioned, but could we get a pause feature? Its obnoxious not being able to pause for a few minutes when a teammate disconnects or you have to do something really fast.
agreed, pausing would be nice... specially if we could get a replace function(replacing a leaver)


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Fire Lord Iroh

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xpyder View Post
I'd like to point out one thing... while in league, items mostly enhance ur champion's abilites(instead of giving you completely new ones or greatly changing one of yours), in dota, in many cases, ur Hero BECOMES his items + his C/C late game... Im glad this doesnt happen in league, you cant buyt some stuff and change ur champion into the sum of his items...
In DotA, your hero never became his items. There was simply enough itemization available to notice distinct differences in the builds of other heroes. In DotA, you will find that a lot of heroes start with similar items, but from then on out the builds will differ.

For example, if you are playing Earthshaker you might invest in Arcane Boots as your first item then work toward Blink Dagger.

As Queen of Pain you might find yourself rushing a Linken's Sphere.

Antimage, could rush treads to Vlad's.

Necrolyte might rush Sheepstick.

Pudge will probably try to go bottle into Hood of Defiance.

Although this is not a large list of heroes you can see variations in builds from the beginning of the game. In LoL casters almost always try to get 1 or 2 Doran's and will proceed to build Death Cap. Casters that aren't doing that are most likely rushing RoA. If you aren't doing that, then you are probably Vlad who will rush Revolver.

AD carries almost always purchase the same items. I understand there is an air of confusion as to what items are good now that the new patch is here, but I assure you after a few months you will see that AD carries will be purchasing the same items as one another.

The list goes on.

However, for some reason, there are certain champions that have no place in this game. The flaw is not necessarily with their kits, but perhaps the lack of appropriate itemization that allows them to acquire the stats or effects they need to be good. It is an issue that has plagued LoL as a part of all the power-creeping that has occurred. However, one simple item for a hero that is currently lacking might restore them to having a proper place in this game. I mean Black Cleaver revived Pantheon, Renekton, and Talon. I'm sure Riot can think of something to help out melee carries as well as other heroes that are weak across the board.


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Apollinarius

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by basketofseals View Post
You must not have played for a long time, because certain spells(they're not necessarily ultimates) are hard coded to pierce magic immunity. This is most noticeable for certain skills such as Enigma's Black Hole and Kunkka's Ghost Ship which are only partially affected by magic immunity.
I think back in the day, those were the corner cases because they didn't do magic damage, but instead did effects to everything in the area. I think Time Stop was one of those as well. But you couldn't Omnislash or cast Doom or Laguna Blade or Finger of Death or Culling Blade on someone with BKB active because you couldn't target them with the spell. You also couldn't Blink Strike to someone with BKB.

BKB behavior was hard coded to be the same as Avatar behavior from WC3. WC3 didn't have any of those funny spells. I don't know if Dota 2 fixed any of that behavior.


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Fire Lord Iroh

Senior Member

12-19-2012

bump


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Redeemed In Fire

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by RiotNome View Post
Suboptimal builds are a big part of DotA itemization. Ever seen a Heart of Tarrasque on an INT or Satanic on an AGI? A big part of DotA's itemization is, again, the STR/AGI/INT system, which allows bundling of massive stat bonuses without much second thought. Remember that STR gives health and health regeneration, AGI gives attack speed and armor, and INT gives mana and mana regeneration. In addition that, your primary stat also gives AD, so if you were a STR-primary champ for example, you'd get health, health regeneration, and AD when purchasing STR. Because so many items make use of these stats, most players don't tend to wrap their heads fully around an item's full benefits. And even while every character can utilize each stat's secondary benefits to different extents, buying a non-primary stat and missing out on the AD is still a big deal because of how important AD is to every character in the game. A big reason DotA's itemization tends to blend so well with its characters is because of how incredibly generalized all of the items tend to be due to that system. You're always getting a little bit of everything.

League doesn't have bundled stats; everything is separate and explicit. You could imagine how broad the itemization would be if everything was like a little chunk of Trinity Force.
Consider Ursa. I'm not a great Dota player. Near as I can tell though, your job is to basically pick high-CC allies, build Vladimir's Offering, then go tank and use your ult and your absurdly strong damage ramp to stomp face. Also solo Roshan o.O AGI is an okay stat on him but you really want more strength.


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IS1d89a4d7a8ba5a2d1bd0a

Senior Member

12-19-2012

When I play Dota, I feel like I buy items, to deal with the current situtation in the best possible way.

When I play LoL, I feel like I have to buy a select few items to make my champion mathematicaly stronger than before.