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AD caster item

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Shemsu Hor

Senior Member

12-13-2012

~please not that this post will be changing as I see fit while exchanging ideas with other members. ill try to post changes made; perhaps in a different post.

60 AD, 20 Armor, 15% Spell vamp, 8% cd reduction notice this is ONLY AD making it non viable for mages and prime for AD casters.

Example would be change spell vamp or life steal to work on skills like talon's Q. As it stands only life steal will heal from his on hit but will not give any life for the damage from the bleed. But buying life steal does not proc the bleed, his rake, or his ultimate so spell vamp is the only route for these... the issue is spell vamp items are ALWAYS combined with AP which is not useful on someone like zed or talon using only AD scaling skills. (multiple sources like a gunblade having lifesteal and spell vamp would not stack. Only the higher percentage would take effect.)

just and idea...

~ ~ Also I would like to say I very much appreciate the upcoming changes to diana and cho. I've been asking for that exact nerf to chogath for almost 2 years now, and those exact diana nerfs since shes been out.
I am very grateful riot ~ ~


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JustMyBassCannon

Recruiter

12-13-2012

Talon's Q initial damage benefits from Lifesteal, buddy. I'm also pretty sure that Spell Vamp would heal for the DoT (not 100%, don't quote me on that) but the damage is so low you wouldn't notice it without 100% Spell Vamp.


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Shemsu Hor

Senior Member

12-13-2012

Quote:
JustMyBassCannon:
Talon's Q initial damage benefits from Lifesteal, buddy. I'm also pretty sure that Spell Vamp would heal for the DoT (not 100%, don't quote me on that) but the damage is so low you wouldn't notice it without 100% Spell Vamp.


Q does benefit from life steal but he is a caster.. he shouldn't be building life-steal with his kit if there were proper items to fit him and the others. what i meant is the hit of a "skill" doesnt actually proc the life its the fact that he auto attacked, that was a bad example sorry.
And the DoT does not receive from spell vamp BUT is VERY high it scales better than the bonus damage on his Q. all extra life is noticed Im sure you have had many encounters were you died or killed with only a sliver of life... it counts.

* I've edited my original post sorry that was very unclear and a bad example*


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67chrome

Senior Member

12-13-2012

Quote:
Shemsu Hor:
65 AD, 15 Armor Pen, 12% Skill vamp, 8% cd reduction. (skill vamp being specified as any skill your champion uses will heal for 15% of the damage delt.) notice this is ONLY AD making it non viable for mages and prime for AD casters.


I honestly don't see the point of creating "Skill Vamp". Spell Vamp already applies to pretty much everything life steal doesn't. You're just creating another unnecessary and awkward mechanic.

Beyond that this is also rather redundant with Black Cleaver.


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Shemsu Hor

Senior Member

12-13-2012

Quote:
67chrome:
I honestly don't see the point of creating "Skill Vamp". Spell Vamp already applies to pretty much everything life steal doesn't. You're just creating another unnecessary and awkward mechanic.

Beyond that this is also rather redundant with Black Cleaver.


change in name is redundant changing the configuration of spell vamp itself is more effective, good call.

also why the reference to black cleaver? this is added armor and a way to steal life for ad mages, not shred armor and deal more damage.


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JustMyBassCannon

Recruiter

12-13-2012

Quote:
Shemsu Hor:
Q does benefit from life steal but he is a caster.. he shouldn't be building life-steal with his kit if there were proper items to fit him and the others. what i meant is the hit of a "skill" doesnt actually proc the life its the fact that he auto attacked, that was a bad example sorry.

I've never seen a Talon go wrong with Bloodthirster. Considering Vamp Scepter now builds out of Long Sword, I don't see why Lifesteal would be bad on him at all.
Quote:
Shemsu Hor:
And the DoT does not receive from spell vamp BUT is VERY high it scales better than the bonus damage on his Q. all extra life is noticed Im sure you have had many encounters were you died or killed with only a sliver of life... it counts.

Okay, so it doesn't get Spell Vamp. It still deals only 15+0.2 bonus AD per second (90+1.2 bonus AD over 6 seconds). You don't seem to understand how little that is. It is the weakest non-stacking DoT in the game.
Quote:
Shemsu Hor:
* I've edited my original post sorry that was very unclear and a bad example*

So now you've specified that his DoT doesn't get spell vamp. Okay, still doesn't change that you would need disproportionate amounts of Spell Vamp and AD to notice it healing you if it did.


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Shemsu Hor

Senior Member

12-13-2012

"So now you've specified that his DoT doesn't get spell vamp. Okay, still doesn't change that you would need disproportionate amounts of Spell Vamp and AD to notice it healing you if it did."

Note that this is not an item made only for on hit skills like talons Q, but for champions with skill like rake, HSS, lunge, ect, that would never have the need to build spell vamp *based on the items that exist now* but would benefit greatly from it.


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JustMyBassCannon

Recruiter

12-13-2012

Quote:
Shemsu Hor:
"So now you've specified that his DoT doesn't get spell vamp. Okay, still doesn't change that you would need disproportionate amounts of Spell Vamp and AD to notice it healing you if it did."

Note that this is not an item made only for on hit skills like talons Q, but for champions with skill like rake, HSS, lunge, ect, that would never have the need to build spell vamp but would benefit from it.

...

I'm really not going to respond any more, you've answered yourself for me.


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Shemsu Hor

Senior Member

12-13-2012

I meant based on the items that exist now but thats fine. thank you for the dialog.


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