Diana Nerf - A bit drastic

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Dawncaster

Senior Member

12-17-2012

Not in the least, she had it coming.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Conversion Gel

Senior Member

12-17-2012

Bump till Riot post.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

MEGAFIGGOT

Junior Member

12-18-2012

Right but Riot doesn't care about your sole opinion because there is a lot of people with different opinions.
They nerfed diana because she was pickd a lot in tourneys, but even in these tournaments she had a perfect 50% win ratio.
All the range nerf are overkill, but hey atleast less people are playing her.

http://i.imgur.com/UfSbc.png


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

GimpyF

Senior Member

12-18-2012

Oh good a Diana post where people aren't just hounding on Riot.

Same as Rengar nerf, I didn't like the Diana nerf. I feel it was a hasty decision based on her overprominence in IPL. But don't forget that even in IPL her winrate stayed exactly balanced. Now they brought her from 50% to 40% win rate, setting a steep challenge to anyone playing the champion. On top of that, the casual Diana player doesn't have the perfect team synergy to fall back on. This might make picking her a massive risk.

Many people believe a kit like Diana's is broken by definition. She's a tanky burst assassin with dps and initiation subroutines. Like Rengar's kit, proponents state, it's too much stuff squashed into one champion. The powercreep argument. It's too easy to capitalize on.

Riot had a choice, I believe. Her pre-nerf kit came together well with a 50% win rate, but top teams unanimously believed one could build a team around her that would synergize out of control and completely dominate almost any game. Because her IPL winrate was also 50%, it's hard to tell if these teams were right, but pros being pros I wouldn't hesitate to take their opinion either.

So she was nerfed, to a champion that is underwhelming stand-alone, but can be presumably build around to build a competively viable, but not over-dominant, team. The Riot balance team has thus solved the issue of 'dealing with' her tricky type of kit.

In my opinion, though, they may as well have strapped four mechanical legs onto her and called her Urgot Mk. II, because she'll never be seen again. The risk of building around her is simply much, much too high if you can also pick a champion that has synergy as well as being reliable on their own.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

turulHAARP

Senior Member

12-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by GimpyF View Post
Many people believe a kit like Diana's is broken by definition. She's a tanky burst assassin with dps and initiation subroutines. Like Rengar's kit, proponents state, it's too much stuff squashed into one champion. The powercreep argument. It's too easy to capitalize on.
The thing is there should not be any tanky burst assassin at all.Look at riven,lee sin etc.They scale so much even without items it's ridiculous.
The same was true for Diana.
It seems everyone forgot that her primary role was TANKY AP champion either with initiation ability or not.Her W was there because of this very reason.However the rest of her kit was too strong and so she became - (people realized her true potential,learned to play with her,maximized her potential)- a tanky burst assassin as you said which should not exist under any circumstance.

The changes are really not that great however.Riot hit the wrong spots in her kit.Or should i say it was a knee-jerk reaction...

The changes/nerfs were the following :

Diana
Crescent Strike:
Base damage reduced to 60/95/130/165/200 from 70/110/150/190/230
Pale Cascade:
Orb detonation damage radius reduced
Adjusted orb hit box to better match the visual effect
Moonfall:
Maximum pull distance reduced
Lunar Rush:
Cast range reduced to 750 from 900

As i said Diana is supposed to be a tanky ap champion not a burst assassin.

However the nerf to Crescent Strike is not good at all.This is her only ranged ability to deal dmg and poke to apply Moonlight debuff and building up the possible combo for initiation,etc.
But this has been nerfed?Why is that?It was not that hard to avoid the hit but now this change affects her jungling ability too which is worrysome.
The change i would like to see is reverting back the dmg nerf and instead reduce the range on the skill.I will explain it at Lunar Rush.

The second problem is Pale Cascade has been hit by the nerf.The purpose of this skill is to let Diana absorb dmg and let her survive longer but before it was used as a burst ability.So the change is understandable however it hit again her jungling ability without any buff to it.The dmg on it was a tad bit too much and the orb explode range was quite large too especially when used along with E to pull in enemies.It basically hit everyone for a large amount of dmg.
The problem now here is that the 3rd orb won't explode up as many times as it would be expected so the second layer of shield won't activate.This is caused either because of the orb detonation damage radius reduced or the "adjusted" hit box to better match with visual effect which is likely to cause this simpton.

Changes i would apply here are:
1.A little mechanic change on orbs.If 2 orbs are detonated the 3rd orb will rotate a bit faster to make sure the second layer of shield will activate.

2.Decrease the AP ratio on orbs by 0.1 from 0.6 to 0.5 this is the AP ratio when each orbs detonates.So each orbs would have about 0.17 AP ratio instead 0.2 AP ratio.
BUT in exchange increase the AP ratio on shield .From 0.4 to about 0.5 or even higher to make it feel like a real shield ability with some dmg instead of focusing on the dmg part.

However these changes would only work if orb detonation range is normalized and can be used in almost every case.This is something to take note about.
As right now according to people the range on it is awful and the 3rd orb won't detonate sometimes.Needs to be fixed first!!!


The nerf on Moonfall is understandable.Had too many uses and created many situations where it was a too powerful tool for setting up other AoE abilities.

And now about Lunar Rush.The range was nerfed/decreased probably it was because how easy it was to reach not only the AD carry/support etc. in teamfight but it was also a really powerful ability to use with along E for a possible jungle gank or setting up a jungle gank.
The nerf was needed,honestly...But as people mentioned her fluid gameplay with Q+R disappeared and NOT FUN to play with her in it's current state because of this reason!!!

So what can we do to bring back the good ol' combo with Crescent Strike?
Reduce the range on Crescent Strike to the same as Lunar Rush's 750 range.
This means Crescent Strike will have 750 range down from 830 range which seems drastic.
However the recent dmg nerfs or even more dmg nerfs need to be reverted here to match with the reduced range.
Also don't forget that her role should be tanky ap not someone who can close range without a problem,murder somebody then walk out with shield on and with the low cd on her abilities do this in a short time span.


TL;DR:
1.
  • Reduced range on Crescent Strike to match with Lunar Rush's range to keep her fluid gameplay.New range is 750 down from 830.
  • Revert dmg nerfs on the ability.
  • Possibly increase the dmg further to match with the range nerf.
2.

  • Reduced AP ratio on each orb dmg.New AP ratio on each orb is 0.17 down from 0.2.Maximum AP ratio(when each orb detonates) goes down from 0.6 to 0.5 this way.
  • Increased AP ratio on shield strength to turn it into a real shield ability wit minor focus on dmg.Up to 0.5 or higher from 0.4.
  • Mechanic change so the 3rd orb will rotate slightly faster if 2 orb already detonated to ensure the activation of the second layer of shield. This change also helps with jungling since it will provide a better shield to absorb dmg.


So basically reduced the range on Q to match with R for a more fluid gameplay but increased the dmg on it.This helps to keep her ability to jungle as before with this ability.
Switched a little dmg of the orbs to better shield strength to further increase her ability to absorb dmg and survive longer while dealing a little less dmg.This also keeps her ability to jungle as before with this ability by providing longer time without taking dmg.
All in all she becomes a real tanky ap champion instead of her former self.


Anyway we should wait at least 2-3 weeks before drawing conclusion regarding this matter.

A feedback from a Red would be appreciated.
Thanks for reading.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

txtmsg

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

12-18-2012

I think Riot over did it again... just like Irelia. They overnerfed Diana.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

SeiYouSiLa

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLAUGHTERHOUSEqq View Post
GOODBYE FACEROLL BADDIES!!!, NEXT NERF FLIGHT TO DARIUS IN T-MINUS 5 HOURS BETTER HOP ON THE TRAIN.
Seriously, all I see are a bunch of normal game baddies who used diana as a crutch to feel good about themselves crying like little two year olds, YOU'RE NOT GOOD, go play ori or something.
OH ****! WE GOT A BADASS OVER HERE!!

Suggestion, you shouldn't play Orianna as you're clearly a noob and can't handle a champion with skill cap as high is Orianna


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Bob the bomber

Senior Member

12-19-2012

I would agree that this nerf sucks... but why can we not fix champions that do suck like Karma and Zed?


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Katasumai

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

12-19-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Statikk might be posting more, but let me update on the details that are concerning in a TLDR sense;

Diana: We overnerfed here, agreed. Will fix next patch.

Rengar: We need to tear him down a bit to build him back up - someone earlier in this thread mentioned that he has too many things to be both balanced and fun, and that's the same problem we detect. There will be additional changes next patch.
See this link


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

SiKkNdTwiSt3D

Senior Member

12-19-2012

agreed. take the nerfs away from diana. Diana is totally useless. Buff diana please.