Support still needed?

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vicopogi

Member

12-16-2012

I the meta adc sup bot still good? I think its better if its adc and another melee initiating champs like pantheon or voli or whatever. Right?


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adc

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Master Recruiter

12-16-2012

No. Support is still a needed role.

Remember, the early game isn't all that matters. If you do put a hero like panth or voli bottom lane, they're going to fall off VERY hard as the game progresses. If you don't get a ton of kills and snowball the lane, they're going to be worthless.

We don't take supports because they keep the carry alive, we take supports because they do well regardless of how much gold they get. We just happen to put them with the carry and give them the task of keeping the carry alive because it makes the most sense.


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vicopogi

Member

12-16-2012

But they can snowball from kills. I mean, they can easily kill both adc and sup. what else if theres a gank from their jungler. That will determine the game imo.


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PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

12-16-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicopogi View Post
But they can snowball from kills. I mean, they can easily kill both adc and sup. what else if theres a gank from their jungler. That will determine the game imo.
So you'd rather have a lane that will thrive if they get kills but choke and die if they're forced to survive off CS because the enemy duo-bot is playing defensively?

You'd prefer that to an ADC/Support that will do just fine if they're forced to survive on CS alone, but if they earn some kills, they'll snowball into mid and late game that much quicker?



EDIT: And for the record, Volibear isn't out of the question filling the standard support role. He's just far superior to a LOT of other supports.


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Proxy345

Senior Member

12-16-2012

But how can the support keep the adc alive if they get flung by someone like Volibear? I had a ranked match earlier. I was using Sona and supporting Ezreal against a Volibear and Tristana bot lane combo,it didn't go so well. Voli flung Ezreal towards Tristana tons of times and healing didn't help too much since its too much damage,so they snowballed.


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vicopogi

Member

12-16-2012

Yeah. Thats why i came up with this idea. They willsnowball easily from kills. Stunning an adc and constant harass will affect enemy's farm and is easier to gank imo.


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Freon160

Member

12-16-2012

Support is still necessary, however, I think that the meta is moving towards more aggressive support styles.
I fully believe we will be seeing Rengar supports this year.


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adc

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12-16-2012

Here's why you won't be seeing a Rengar support, or a Veigar support:

They need farm. Period. Leona works well as a support because she can live on just the gp10 and do well. Voli does alright with that. The problem with a Rengar support is that he CAN'T do his job - simply CANNOT - without farm. Rengar's job is to jump in and gib a carry quickly. He can't do that without items.

If he snowballs - great. But if he trades with the enemy, or he doesn't get kills - you're totally ****ed, because now he's way behind and you don't have any utility.


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PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

12-16-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicopogi View Post
Yeah. Thats why i came up with this idea. They willsnowball easily from kills. Stunning an adc and constant harass will affect enemy's farm and is easier to gank imo.
Yea, but the thing is, there already exist "kill lane" supports that are still perfectly viable mid and late game even if they get 0 kills.

You can't just look at how good Volibear would be as a support if his lane manages to get a ton of kills. You can't. You're not going to be able to manage those kills every time. You have to look at whether or not Volibear is still useful to you 40 minutes into the game with no farm, and having had to build support items like Ruby Sightstone, Philosopher Stone, etc.

Is Volibear's flip+slow more effective at securing kills for the ADC than Blitzcrank's pull+knockup, Alistar's headbutt+knockup, Leona's stuns+passive, etc? I mean, is Volibear support actually better than these champions at securing kills and protecting the ADC? And if so, by how much?

And meanwhile, we still have to have the discussion about a 0/0/0 Volibear 20 minutes into the game versus a 0/0/0 Blitzcrank, Alistar, or Leona 20 minutes into the game.


Is the risk worth the reward?


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Synystr Minister

Junior Member

12-16-2012

u need someone to NOT take cs