i am having trouble understanding mechanics

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Painfullv4

Member

12-07-2012

Well i am not completely new i have about 200 games played, i am having trouble understand the mechanics of the game but my question is when i try to jungle my teammate in mid goes from the lane take the jungle farm. i play with the same people who are much more experienced then me but when i ask how is it better that mid takes jungle, wouldn't that just put the jungle behind? the response was "because the pros do it that's why it works" , i am sorry that makes no sense to me like the "would you jump off a bridge if someone else did" scenario. what i thought a jungler was :

The jungler is a wildcard and can turn the tide of the game by constantly moving and surprising the enemy. Jungling also provides you with the two neutral buffs that can massively help your champion in battle.

is this definition correct?

Well since season 3 support has been awesome, but they still are not as strong as someone who was in lane by themselves thats 100% understandable why that happens, but if jungle is taken and the jungle is behind and team middle is taking jungle would that mean you now have 2 almost useless players?.my logic tells me that if jungle is behind then that means weak or no ganks but that makes me wonder what is jungle suppose to do again?

Another question i have is while playing support Sona i bought wards and had the map covered with them so i bought some mana items and some AP to makes my poke a little more damaging while buffing my heal, in 4 games a different player tells me i am not suppose to buy any Ap or mana items and only buy pink wards and such?

I apologize if i sound like i am complaining, i am honestly trying to not come off as a complainer, but iam hopeing someone can explain to me why the game works this way with logic, because i believe decision making needs to be done with logic behind it.

thank you for your time.

TLDR:

- i feel as if other players taking the jungle just puts the jungle more behind and soon i become so useless in the game, i dont quite understand WHY it would be helpful to the team if mid takes jungle farm other then because mid can become stronger, but if i am suppose to give jungle to mid then why not just take a support champ in jungle?

-another thing is when i get counter jungled i get destroyed, so i try to buy wards to ward out the jungle so that way if we catch enemy in our jungle so with team help we can kill the counter


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IS134793e5f3c35e84c7d25

Senior Member

12-07-2012

depends on the mid and the jungler, some mids desperately need the blue buff. some junglers despereately need the blue buffs, like sejuani and amumu. Some junglers don't need blue buff, some mids don't need need blue buff.

some junglers can't farm small camps as fast and get gold per second stuff, so they focus mainly on ganking and controlling the buffs and objectives. like nunu, he needs mid to farm wraiths and wolves and top/bot to farm the golems, whilst he is controlling the buffs and ganking and clearing out wards himself with an oracles and wards. other junglers would want to take the wraiths wolves golems alot more.

letting mid have blue generally would help them as much as it would help you, what hurts you may not necessarily be hurting the team as a whole. but mainly depends on the mid and the jungler in the game. try not to pick a mana heavy jungler if your mid is very mana heavy.

when it comes to counter jungling that means you are too slow to be taking the buffs, you can't just let them sit for a long time, that gives the enemies more time to steal it. if you plan on leaving a buff and not taking it for a while ward it so if the enemy tries to take it, then you can see and hopefully steal the buff he was trying to steal and wind of killing him as a bonus. Through out hte game check their buffs, and if it is gone, you'll see when it spawns and a good idea to try to take it right when it spawns before their jungler can take their own buff. If you never check the enemy buffs you won't know if they are gone and when they will spawn again won't be seen on mini map.


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Painfullv4

Member

12-07-2012

i usually jungle with olaf or Kah,zix i feel without blue i have a really hard time in jungle


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Necrotic Frost

Member

12-08-2012

I primarily jungle, so hopefully I can help out a bit.

As far as mid taking jungle, that is fine. Most mid players will either attempt to steal the enemies wraiths or just take their own jungles wraiths. This allows them to get more cs which in the long run will benefit the team more. The reason why it benefits the team is because the mid player is usually a burst AP champion which can put out high amounts of damage, so they need to be well farmed in order to buy their items to "carry" the team. You should be in lane quite a bit after level 4 anyway, so it is better that someone takes the fast respawning camps if your not near them. That way the enemies jungle isnt taking them from your team.

Jungles sole purpose in life is to assist the lanes and make things happen. Whenever possible you want to let your ADC and AP mid take enemy kills, because they are your highest dmg dealers. Olaf should not need blue after the first one. Olaf's main dmg dealing ability does not use mana, so with olaf you should be giving away every blue buff after the first. Even with Kah'zix you should not need blue buff after the first. The only champions that really need blue consistently to jungle are AP champs like Mumu and Fiddle.

As the above poster said you need to pick jungles that will compliment team composition. I only pick a mana abusive jungler when the mid is like katarina, because she does not need the buff unless she just really wants a CD reduction. But the two you are playing you should not have mana issues. Just dont spam your abilities when you dont have to.


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Uncanny Doom

Senior Member

12-08-2012

The camps have timers so the real thing that matters isn't that your laner farms your jungle, it's when they farm your jungle. For example, mid game when team fights are happening or people are roaming, it's better to give your red buff to the AD Carry. After you get your first blue, it's generally always a good idea to give the rest of your blue buffs to your AP Mid. With the wraith camp (Very commonly farmed by mid), it's okay to give to your mid laner imo if they're relatively even in lane and you aren't behind in jungle. If you're getting counter jungled or you got set back in a lvl 1 invade or something, your laner should not be farming wraiths as early as they normally do. Typically when I jungle I will tell my team at X minutes (let's say 10) or when I hit X level (let's say 4 or 6 depending on the jungler) that they can farm my wraiths all they want.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Painfullv4 View Post
i usually jungle with olaf or Kah,zix i feel without blue i have a really hard time in jungle
If you are having trouble clearing camps without blue (with the exception of your first clear) then you're probably doing something wrong with your build, runes, or masteries.


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Painfullv4

Member

12-08-2012

Wow actually violenttranquili that made alot of sense, i played a game now that i know why it is that it works actually improved my game a little bit ty for your help


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Necrotic Frost

Member

12-08-2012

No problem, glad I could help a bit. Feel free to add me in game if you need more help.