(@Riot, why not) How to play Kassadin the RIGHT way. Idiots.

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Guy on a bus

Senior Member

12-07-2012

I don't know why but all of these creative insults are so damn funny, I don't care if I'm feeding the troll.

Sodium is right for real though, any ADC ranged or melee with the brains of a 5 year old will rip you apart silence or not.


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Doc Walrus

Junior Member

12-07-2012

That's the nice thing about censoring the usual profanity; it encourages innovation. And there's no trolling here, just the best Kassadin build ever and several gallons of boiling hatred.

Speaking of how justified that hatred is, it sounds like not a single one of you terrible accidents has actually played the damn build. Even you, Guy on a Bus, and you're the star of this godforsaken class. Shut up. Get on LoL. Follow the guide. Go see how much Ashe can beat you ~in theory :3 :3~ when you ult in through a wall and ironically carve her into the shape of a crossbow. Do it, you failure. You are the human equivalent of expired milk with a hint of asparagus, and I'm using the term "Human" more loosely than anyone should.

Meanwhile, I'll be using LoLReplay to round up some replays of my work. Stay tuned, you autistic rodents.


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Khell DarkWolf

Senior Member

12-07-2012

Its not unheard of to play Kassadin this way and quite honestly alot have forgotten that there was many ways to tailor Kassadin for what situation you were in.

It was one of the many ways to play him back in beta and early stages of season 1, and most have only understood him to be only played one way which was the Burst and mana build.

That Nether blade active for 50 Armor Pen was awesome though back in the day.


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SodiumAzide

Senior Member

12-07-2012

Oh my god you are so precocious it just makes me smile. Okay, so you want me to dispense with the theory?

Here is the thing, I am not opposed to your build because of a kneejerk reaction, my main AP mid is Kog'maw. It would be foolish of me to throw stones, but this is the problem that you are glazing over. Your silence is not long enough for a sustained DPS build to work. One of the things that makes Kassadin dangerous is his ability to do damage to you during the window of his silence. Once that window passes unless he is at a substantial advantage over a mage he has to withdraw.

Here is the realistic problem with your build. You have no laning phase, and you have no way to get the gear you need to be effective in a teamfight or in lane ganks.

I mentioned that I play AP kog? Well here is a fun fact. Not once have I lost a lane to Kassadin. I beat him to six and I beat him in CS by a minimum of 20. I usually end up a kill or so up on him by the end of the laning phase and take his tower before 15 to 20 minutes. This is with one of the weakest in lane AP's. Kassadin is only strong when he can take kills off of his lane opponents or when he can bully them out and then gank on other lanes. It is simply his mechanic. This is the reason why once you get above 1300 people stop banning him. He is just not that much of a success once you get enough of the game to understand his difficulties.

Now I have no doubt that you have had great success with this build in your blind pick normal games, , but one of the problems with taking that experience and applying it to anything beyond that is that there are plenty of very successful but sub par builds that occupy the twilight nether of the sub 1200, and even more builds that require your opponents not to see you coming. There are very few characters where you can do this, and in the end your build does not negate the problems that kassadin has.

Kassadin cannot carry with the build you have chosen. I know that doing 260 average magic damage at a rate of maybe 1.3 attacks a second seems boss to you but there are serious magic damage carries that can do that while falling down stairs. And ADC's would have to knee cap themselves to do twice that much damage.


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Doc Walrus

Junior Member

12-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by K?ss?din View Post
Its not unheard of to play Kassadin this way and quite honestly alot have forgotten that there was many ways to tailor Kassadin for what situation you were in.

It was one of the many ways to play him back in beta and early stages of season 1, and most have only understood him to be only played one way which was the Burst and mana build.

That Nether blade active for 50 Armor Pen was awesome though back in the day.
I feel like it would be inconsistent to really reply to this, since there's nothing to belittle you about. +1, moving on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SodiumAzide View Post
Okay, so you want me to dispense with the theory?
NO. Good god this is the third time I'm telling you this. Theorycrafting is a plague on every competitive game community, and it can go on for months without accomplishing a goddamn thing. Go make a thread about AP Kog (who is an engine of goddamn destruction) and see all the retarded comments you'll get from abortions-gone-wrong telling you their theory about how AP kog simply could not do as much damage as AD kog, because you would eventually run out of mana, your ult will miss more than 0% of the time, you have no escapes and therefore are a free kill to whichever champion they think of first, you don't have crits and therefore do zero damage, I could do this for a decade, son. It's easy. Play Melee DPS Kassadin and make sense of its beauty after you clean other people's blood off of you.


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Novagrol

Junior Member

12-07-2012

I've played Kassadin numerous times, and what I've found is that some attack speed can be beneficial mid-late game, after you've build your standard ap items (RoA, Rabadon etc). This way you maintain your burst damage, and can apply your w to finish those that survive.

A typical end game build for me (assuming a good game) would be Mercury/Archangel/Rabadon, then Nashor's Tooth, and finally whatever situational items I need.

I'm no expert in playing Kass, but a AP-focused build with some attack speed thrown in seems to work well for me...

So, not completely inconceivable to build pure dps, but probably less effective than a burst AP build in my opinion~


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Guy on a bus

Senior Member

12-07-2012

Couldn't be bothered. Sodium is right once again. There is a reason why Kassa is never banned, and why no one ever plays him. Same reason that Kassa was bought on my very first account but never again. He is situational at best.


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SodiumAzide

Senior Member

12-08-2012

I enjoy the fact that you have degenerated (this means "become lower"). Since you missed the point coming up on 3 times now I am going to be a very nice man and simplify it.

1. kassadin has no laning phase
2. Without burst he struggless to be an effective bully or ganker
3. Your build does not mitigate(this means "reduces badness"), and in fact exacerbates (this means "makes worse") Kassadins issues.

Here is some advice

1. You are entirely lacking in penetration stats. You need sorcerors shoes at minimum and a void staff would benefit you more than a deathcap. If you are committed to doing the on hit build you have to remember this, most of your magic damage is independant ("not reliant on") of AP. The muramana gives on average 60 damage (much more if you can keep you mana topped off), the wits end is 42 the .45 of your ap is approximately 100 and the base spell damge is 90. Of that 300 damage, 200 is independant of AP. With zero penetration against a 100 MR target you will do half damage. If you have a void staff and sorcerors you will be getting roughly 70% of your damage. Damage per strike goes from 150 to roughly 180 with a fractional loss in attack speed.

2. Because of the way that kassadin functions you are best off using the mana tank build as a baseline and evolving from there. That way you can use on hit effects and get mpen and not have to worry about defense or mobility. You are pulling in too many directions.

3. Play more than one game of ranked. It will give you an entirely new perspective on how actually good you are and on what being counterpicked is like. Your single crushing defeat as evelynn is not exactly the experience you need. (Oh and I reviewed your season 2 as well, very impressive stats as an AP mid. You almost went positive with none of them!!!)

PS. A better version of your build would be Muramana, ROa, frozen heart, wits end and void staff. This way you can actually do significant damage with your ulti and you are tanky. In actuality this would be a very interesting variant on manatank kassadin and might be much more effective than a straight up AP assassin.

PPS, attack speed reds? REALLY? No! Get Mpen reds, get mpen blues enough to get 10 flat pen 4 I think now. Use attack speed QUINTS and armor yellows. Ugh, I didn't even realize how much less damage you are doing. You actually are sitting on only the 8% pen you get from offense? Jesus christ the ignorance. Here is fun point of order. Your 195 AD means nothing because of one thing. SCALING ARMOR. Even a **** carry gets if and even one armor item, like a GA cuts that damage in half, more than half. You are all magic damage. Lemme give you some math.

8% magic pen gives you a 0.52 damage modifier vs 100 MR
8% magic pen gives you a 0.68 damage modifier vs 50 MR
8% and 35% mpen and -25 mpen gives you a 0.74 damage mod vs 100 MR
8% and 35% mepn and -25 mpen gives you a 0.95 damage mod vs 50 MR

I am going to do you a huge favor and I am going to seriously hit the grindstone and give you the numbers on exactly what you are looking at.


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SodiumAzide

Senior Member

12-08-2012

Okay kiddo, here is the deal. Your best DPS setup is going to Malady, void, wits end, Seraphs embrace, sorc shoes, roa. You will do more DPS than the build you are currently doing and you will have superior mana efficiency. Your DPS single target 50 MR is gonna be 440 with the build you are using, and roughly 470 with the above. Against 100 MR its 336 vs 360. Your Ulti and force pulse will hit much harder and your null sphere comes out about even.

Muramana is a very powerful tool, but because you scale off of AP better than AD you are better served with the benefits of AA, even including the proc. To maximize your damage you are going to need to cast your ulti as often as possible and the mana drain of muramana doesn't benefit that strategy. As long as you stick to your target you should be regenerating 90 to 100 mana a second on top of your base and able to spam your spells. Replacing the malady or the void staff with a frozen heart will drop your overall DPS significantly,20- 30% or so but may be worth it conditionally.


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