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Vi, the Piltover Enforcer - Feedback Thread

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The SkyBorne

Senior Member

12-12-2012

Vi is insanely fun, even if she may take some time to get used to.

Her Q is amazing for utility, and it deals a nice chunk of damage as well. Great for initiations, the beginning of the combo, and those quick escapes.

I wish there was an active for her W, but nonetheless it makes her a force to be wreckoned with when fought alone.

Her E is great, especially with proper positioning and it's AOE effect. It greatly enhances Vi's team fight presence, and the attack reset contributes to her 1v1 fight as well. It is also very nice when you are chasing an enemy with low health, and you can finish em off by hitting a minion and letting the shockwave kill them.

Her ultimate just wrecks everyting. From saving your allies, dealing TONNES of Damage (if your positioning is great) , finishing off the adc or chasing down a teemo. Great game changing ult, although total amount of CC is low compared to say amumu's ult, the stackability with AD makes up for the gap with damage. The removal of denting blows doesn't seem too unfair, since her ult already gives so much already.

I enjoy her passive. As long as you have the right timing, you can survive being kited, or be the kiter. It also makes her deceptively tanky when initiating team fights.

When i look at Vi, i like to think of a juggernaut. Great for initiation, great for dealing damage. A real pain to kill. But despite her amazing qualities, she is very gankable. Her susceptibility to ganks is almost as bad as darius. Once she uses her Q to engage, she lacks any escape (unless you happened to have a flash) and even though she does amazing damage, her burst is rarely enough to finish off a decent adc before help arrives.

If you build her pure Damage, her initial burst is strong, and she becomes a massive presence in team fights. If the enemy is smart, they will focus her first. Unless her team is there to peel for her, she will die pretty fast. Unlike Tryndamere or Master Yi, once focused, she has no way to slow the enemy damage while her team mates do some clean up.

Pure Tank is ridiculously fun. She still does a sizeable chunk of damage due to her W, and her Q and R are great for disrupting the enemy team. Her passive makes her hard as hell to kill. And the tank aspect allows for her team to be a bit slower when following up her initiation.

Attack Speed. Punch First, Ask Questions While Punching... Although it is seriously fun watching her beat up on a malphite, any sort of kite or CC pretty much equals instant death. Still fun to do if you are winning your lane hard.

Ability Power. I have not tried this, but I'm pretty sure it would be the same as something like AP talon. Fun for a troll build, but you are basically relying on your base stats/runes/masteries for all your damage.

Tanky Dps. Most Vi players do this,I have tried this twice and it is definitely balanced. she has the survivability to take on champions 1v2, and her damage cannot be ignored in team fights.

Playing Against Vi: I think the main reason most people hate Vi is her ability to pound a single target into submission if caught seperated from the group. Unless the lone target is tanky as hell, it's pretty much a free kill.


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MobiusOne

Member

12-12-2012

First off I would like to say that I REALLY enjoy Vi and I have had tons of fun with her.

Second, I feel she is in a good spot now after these changes except the ultimate. I feel it needs that denting blows proc now that the W is nerfed. I would say reduce the scaling to maybe 1.2 instead of 1.4 and maybe hit the base damage one more time. Something like 175/275/375? Numbers can always be changed but just an idea.


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Flyingace13

Senior Member

12-12-2012

With the new ult change her ult just doesn't feel as epic, don't get me wrong she is still incredibly fun and I've been waiting a long time for a new bruiser of my style to come out so I'll still be getting her...but regardless of that it just doesn't feel as good getting her full combo off anymore without tht applying denting blows that's just part of her kit, yes she needed a nerf(albeit not a big one as I think PBE always seems to give the impression that the new champs are crazy op because people just don't try to counter-play them, she is 100% AD pretty easy to counter) but I dont think this is the right choice...its like making Vayne not proc her passive on her q or e and those are not on an ults CD.


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RedPlanet

Senior Member

12-12-2012

Oh, for a direct response to the most recent question, I'd say I'd rather see the W less powerful in all circumstances than have the R reduced in power.

All her abilities seem to be about being mobile and having free choice of targets, so it's not as necessary to have a long-term solution against harder targets. And even if she didn't have a W it wouldn't really change her fun factor much.


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PearOfDucks

Recruiter

12-12-2012

This is my feedback thread for VI, i have just finished running through about 20 games on pbe as her and i'm still enjoying it!

A: First off her kit, i actually think her kit is a bit too strong as of this moment. Maybe its just the presence of the black cleaver but seriously she packs a punch (no pun intended).

B. She is super fun to play. I felt like a real boxer chasing people around and punching them in the face!

C. Viability, honestly she is as solid is riven is, if not stronger. The shield on her passive makes he viable top lane, while her solid AOE + initiation + CC/CC Reduction brings a massive amount to a team. All in all she is a great addition to a top lane or a jungle.


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ZeruFenrir

Senior Member

12-12-2012

My feedback:

Passive: Solid and useable, helps her do her job.

Q: Probably her most fun skill to use, its cooldown at early levels feels a tad too high still.

W: This skill does way too much as a passive, % Max HP, Armor Reduction and Attack speed. Lowering the Armor Reduction was a good step, but I feel this skill is way too strong as it stands. Maybe lower its numbers as a passive, and have it activate for full effect.

E: I feel the base numbers on this skill need to go up and that its ratio needs to go down. As it stands it seems like a incredible 1 point wonder because its base numbers barely change, but its ratio is so high you don't need to level it anyway.

R: This skill is just wonderful. If you are removing Denting Blows from it, you might consider increasing its base damage again though.

Overall she is an incredibly fun champion to play, I haven't had this much fun on a champ since Riven was released.


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OMNIblue

Junior Member

12-12-2012

Quote:
gypsylord:
Patch notes:

W:
Reduced AD scaling to 1% per 35 AD (down from 1% per 30AD)

R:
Reduced base damage to 200/325/450 (down from 200/350/500)
R no longer applies denting blows.

So the nerf I'm guessing you guys are noticing the most is the removal of the denting blows stack on R. From a gameplay standpoint I really dislike this change. It majorly cuts into Vi's flow and combo feel. From a balance standpoint however we think it may be necessary as a way to tone down Vi's burst damage (WHICH WAS INSANELY HIGH) without having to make the bases on her W, E or R feel awful on their own. The reason she's bursting so hard right now is her ult basically guarantees that she will instantly proc denting blows. The combo is R, auto, E+W proc, Q, auto, E+W proc. That's a HUGE amount of burst. Removing the denting blows from the ult seems to solve this.


The question I have for you guys is this:
How unfun is it having denting blows removed from the ult?
Very.

Do you want it back?
Yes.

If so, what would be a better feeling way to nerf Vi's burst in place of this change?
Like others suggested, if you add denting blows back on to her ult reduce the base damage to compensate. As it stands right now her ult from early to mid game just feels extremely weak. Its only around the 40 minute mark after about 4 complete items where it really feels like it is of any sort of use.

Should we hit W base damage?
No.

W AD ratio?
Maybe scaling back the ratio slightly will help.

E damage?
I think E is fine where it is.

Base AD?
Nope.

On a side note I know we have gotten away from the discussion about her Q. The charge time reduction was a move in the right direction but it still feels like a hiccup in her overall flow compared to the rest of her kit...I still think the damage should be reduced or maybe not apply denting blows to champs so we can get rid of that 15% movement speed reduction or reduce the charge time to 1 second. Just a thought.


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Cayten Shift

Senior Member

12-12-2012

Quote:
gypsylord:
Patch notes:

W:
Reduced AD scaling to 1% per 35 AD (down from 1% per 30AD)

R:
Reduced base damage to 200/325/450 (down from 200/350/500)
R no longer applies denting blows.

So the nerf I'm guessing you guys are noticing the most is the removal of the denting blows stack on R. From a gameplay standpoint I really dislike this change. It majorly cuts into Vi's flow and combo feel. From a balance standpoint however we think it may be necessary as a way to tone down Vi's burst damage (WHICH WAS INSANELY HIGH) without having to make the bases on her W, E or R feel awful on their own. The reason she's bursting so hard right now is her ult basically guarantees that she will instantly proc denting blows. The combo is R, auto, E+W proc, Q, auto, E+W proc. That's a HUGE amount of burst. Removing the denting blows from the ult seems to solve this.

The question I have for you guys is this:
How unfun is it having denting blows removed from the ult? Do you want it back? If so, what would be a better feeling way to nerf Vi's burst in place of this change? Should we hit W base damage? W AD ratio? E damage? Base AD? What do you guys think?
Definitely not a fan of reduced synergy. I'd consider toning down some of her base stats and see where that gets you while restoring the Denting Blows procs.


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Restitution

Senior Member

12-12-2012

Quote:
gypsylord:
Patch notes:

W:
Reduced AD scaling to 1% per 35 AD (down from 1% per 30AD)

R:
Reduced base damage to 200/325/450 (down from 200/350/500)
R no longer applies denting blows.

So the nerf I'm guessing you guys are noticing the most is the removal of the denting blows stack on R. From a gameplay standpoint I really dislike this change. It majorly cuts into Vi's flow and combo feel. From a balance standpoint however we think it may be necessary as a way to tone down Vi's burst damage (WHICH WAS INSANELY HIGH) without having to make the bases on her W, E or R feel awful on their own. The reason she's bursting so hard right now is her ult basically guarantees that she will instantly proc denting blows. The combo is R, auto, E+W proc, Q, auto, E+W proc. That's a HUGE amount of burst. Removing the denting blows from the ult seems to solve this.

The question I have for you guys is this:
How unfun is it having denting blows removed from the ult? Do you want it back? If so, what would be a better feeling way to nerf Vi's burst in place of this change? Should we hit W base damage? W AD ratio? E damage? Base AD? What do you guys think?


Hit the W base damage. At the moment as Vi you can build very tanky and still deal a ton of damage because of your W procs, so making it rely on ad scaling a bit more will definitely tone her down a bit. Also I really dislike the denting blows removal on R, it really ruins the combo-feel I had when using her R and now most of the time any AD carry get slip away from me without getting the W proc off. I feel the insta W proc is a necessity for her burst late game on ad carries, as champions like vayne can just R-Q away and you're left with all abilities on cooldown and no way of getting back on the adc.

Her base stats needs some minor nerfs as well. To reiterate, she really does not need a ton of damage in her itemization to burst people down, and reducing her base stats may solve that a bit.

To recap: Nerf W base damage and base stats, and bring back denting blows on R: she needs the burst late game or she's going to be useless, as her kit has no way of giving her sustained damage in fights.


On a side note: Her E doesn't feel like it flows correctly with her AA's sometimes. Sometimes it feels slower than your regular AA and I end up moving before it finishes casting, ending up with a very clunky feeling to it.

This is especially noticeable when trying to clear waves with a Q-E. I Q into the wave and when I try to e-click the minions behind me it takes an extra second or so for it to actually go off.


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awisefool

Member

12-12-2012

Quote:
gypsylord:
OOOH so that's the problem with her Q. The moveblock cancels your move command so you stop after dashing unless you issue another order.

I actually tried to fix this once. It seems like it would be an awesome change on the surface but it actually makes her feel a lot worse . The problem is that a lot of times when using Q you'll be clicking in directions you won't necessarily be dashing to. Then when you dash you immediately try to start running to the place you last clicked.

Example: You're chasing a sona and start to charge Q. While charging you click Sona but then realize J4 is about to gank you so at the last moment you pull a 180 and dash back towards your tower.

If the Q didn't cancel the move command you'd immediately turn around after the dash and start walking towards Jarvan and Sona since that was the last place you right clicked. Not ideal

Other long range jumps act like Vi's Q does currently. Imagine if Tristana's rocket jump didn't cancel her move command. She's just try to run back into the fight after every jump. Would not feel good.


I think in this case people are trying to use it more like Vayne's Tumble or Ezreal's E than Tristana's Rocket Jump. I think those two skills function within the move command, but I could be wrong. They seem to, anyway.

Just my two cents.