Pick Order vs Role Calling - A True Issue.

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ExjK

Senior Member

11-28-2012

People who are higher in pick order feel they get priority.
and
People who call a role feel they get priority.

Let's take a moment to look at both of these mentalities.

~ The way people rationalize their beliefs about pick order say that their ELO is higher therefore they should get the role they want (granted it's available). Doesn't matter if the last pick wants it, they are lowest ELO and are stuck with whatever the last role is (usually support). 95% of the time these people will take the role they want regardless of what anyone else on the team thinks.

~ The way people rationalize their beliefs about calling say that they know what role they are best at and feel they should get to play it (especially in ranked). Doesn't matter what the rest of the team thinks because that doesn't change the fact that they are most confident in the role they call. 95% of the time these people do not get the role they originally wanted, which leads to a troll or someone playing a role they are not confident with.

Now let's get real for a moment.

~ If you're first pick and had planned on going mid but the last pick says, "mid please it's my best role" as soon as the game opens...what do? People who believe in pick order would say, "well who cares it's not about calling" and will proceed to pick despite what last pick wants. Last pick will either deal with this and pick what is needed or complain and troll pick. In this scenario, the team who disregards what last pick wants are at fault. Why? Not because of pick order vs calling...that is not even the issue anymore...it's because the team simply does not care what the last pick wants. As a direct result of this behavior, the team is destined to fail because you've got a bunch of stubborn people playing important roles and a last pick who trolls or plays a role he sucks at (sometimes both).

I'm not saying last pick should troll the team if this happens, in fact nobody should ever troll their team. However the people who play ranked that intentionally disregard what their teammates want and pick very selfishly because "pick order > call order" are in reality...trolls themselves. No matter what you say to justify this behavior, you are trolling.

~ If you're last pick, you call a role but your team does not care and leaves you with support or a role you're not good at...what do? In some cases you may need to dodge the game (if you absolutely cannot play the role you've been left with or your team just doesn't look good). Don't fret though, dodging doesn't make you weak, actually dodging a bad game (especially one where your teammates were dicks and left you with a role you're bad at) makes you a strong teammate. In other cases you may decide to just play out the game in a role you're uncomfortable with, this is okay too. If you do bad in the game, well that's not surprising you knew you were not good at the role to begin with.

Here's where lines are gray. Some people will troll if they don't get the role they called...BAD. Don't ever resort to trolling just cause you didn't get what you wanted, fill what's needed and try your best. If you happen to do bad in the game and your team harasses you, STAY SILENT, just report them at the end. The minute you decide to react and troll/cuss back at them...is the minute you gave up all rights to report. If you happen to report anyway, just know you are directly hurting the tribunal by potentially submitting a biased case...but that's another topic.

Conclusion/TLDR.

To be quite honest, the issue is not even about pick order vs role calling anymore. The issue is that we have people who feel entitled to roles based on pick order and people who genuinely want a role because they are good at it. Trying to justify either of these mentalities is really a lost cause...people who focus on proving their side is right are wasting their efforts...really...because neither side is 100% correct.

When it comes to champ select, there are really only a few things that everyone should think about.

1. What roles do my teammates want? (Doesn't mean they will get what they call, but also doesn't mean you should disregard what they want either.)

2. What champs did the other team pick? (Everyone on your team should be engaged in this awareness, it helps for counter picking AND deciding roles. Sometimes a person who wanted mid will choose something else because they don't want to lane against the enemy mid.)

3. Will I get counter picked? (If you're going to pick a role that the enemy team has not picked yet, proceed with caution. Getting hard countered is one of the primary reasons solo/duo queue sucks, especially when people are fighting for roles instead of working with each other. The best thing to do is pick a champ that can play multiple roles then decide before the game starts OR pick a different role that won't be directly countered.)

If everyone stayed true to these 3 things, then there would be less issue in champ select. There would be less rage, less troll and most importantly...MORE WINS. Yes..more wins. More wins because you have a team that engaged in the champ select and really discussed and worked with each other when picking roles (Pick Order and Role Calling are now non-existent). More wins because your teammates will generally respect you and the team for not bickering about roles and whether pick order is priority over calling roles etc.

TLDR - As much as I dislike you TLDR people...the point I am making is that the issue is no longer whether pick order > role calling or vice versa. The issue is that we have too many selfish people playing this game who argue over which method of role distribution is right. Stop fighting over it, embrace and respect your team...work WITH them (follow the 3 points I listed above).


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NA Kenneth

Senior Member

11-28-2012

From RiotDamiya's words: Don't be a jerk. Communicate and support each other, and make a good team.

That's going to be the victory, not who goes where and who does what. Get along and have a good game, that's all.


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Zamíel

Member

11-28-2012

Lock heim every time tell them your jungle proceed to ignore everything else.


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Shockdamost

Senior Member

11-28-2012

your tldr had a tldr... lol...

but i think you make a valid point, more people should read this


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Ramachese

Senior Member

11-28-2012

As far as I'm concerned when there is a doubt the more critical the role the later he should be picked as it is more difficult for the other team to counter-pick him.


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ExjK

Senior Member

11-28-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by NA Kenneth View Post
From RiotDamiya's words: Don't be a jerk. Communicate and support each other, and make a good team.

That's going to be the victory, not who goes where and who does what. Get along and have a good game, that's all.
It's good advice for sure, we're all random people...fighting over pick priority is pathetic. We should be respecting each other and working as a team at all times!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zamel View Post
Lock heim every time tell them your jungle proceed to ignore everything else.
People who do this deserve to be banned, even if they were being trolled/harassed...reacting like this is just as bad as the people who were trolling/harassing you to begin with.


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ExjK

Senior Member

11-28-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shockdamost View Post
your tldr had a tldr... lol...

but i think you make a valid point, more people should read this
Haha yeah I decided at the end of it that my TLDR was still TL and people DR so I had to make a follow up TLDR. XP

Thanks though I really hope people read it because i'm tired of the meaningless war this issue has waged. Not to mention the tension it's caused in champ select...in fact this overall issue has brought more problems to the game than the original issue did in the first place. =\

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramachese View Post
As far as I'm concerned when there is a doubt the more critical the role the later he should be picked as it is more difficult for the other team to counter-pick him.
I agree for the most part, this is very situational though so it doesn't always work.


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Zamíel

Member

11-28-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ExjK View Post
It's good advice for sure, we're all random people...fighting over pick priority is pathetic. We should be respecting each other and working as a team at all times!



People who do this deserve to be banned, even if they were being trolled/harassed...reacting like this is just as bad as the people who were trolling/harassing you to begin with.

I do it even if Im first pick man heim jungle is alot of fun and people are stupid so I choose to ignore my entire team as soon as the game starts. Nothing like jungling in a completely silent game.


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SasakitheCouncil

Senior Member

11-28-2012

The problem is that there's a fine line between "not being a jerk" and "playing support 90% of the time"

In ranked, I used to always let people play what they wanted, and filled whatever was open all the time. As a result, I ended up playing support a ridiculous amount.

Pick order is the way that nice people get to play what they want sometimes.


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ExjK

Senior Member

11-28-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zamel View Post
I do it even if Im first pick man heim jungle is alot of fun and people are stupid so I choose to ignore my entire team as soon as the game starts. Nothing like jungling in a completely silent game.
I won't complain if people don't stick to the meta in normals, but you're wrong because of this, "people are stupid so I choose to ignore my entire team as soon as the game starts."

It doesn't matter whether it's normal or ranked, if you're going to have that kind of attitude towards your teammates...then you might as well be banned. Sure you have the right to play a game and enjoy yourself, but if you're going to willingly do so at the clear expense of your team then not only should you be banned but you should WANT to stop playing this game...why play a game that turns you into a monster of negativity?