Noxian Guilotine 100 cd lvl1, Demacian Justice 140 cd lvl1.

First Riot Post
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EyeMtheStron9est

Senior Member

11-30-2012

omg @ saying two champs that are mirrors of eachother are not comparible.
omg.


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Tailin

Member

11-30-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ricklessabandon View Post
two things:
-i never said anything about anything being 'viable' or not. i said that hexdrinker isn't a counter to garen.
-i've found that historically it isn't very meaningful to isolate a single aspect of a champion and place it into a very specific scenario for the purposes of evaluating the overall value of said champion.

if you're actually curious to know what i think about garen, darius, et al, you're more than welcome to ask. please be try to be specific with your inquiry if you do though.
I'm not here for the discussion about the damage on Garen and Darius's ultimate, but I would like to just talk about how Riot applied their design philosophy to the two champions.

I've been looking for it for the last few minutes and I can't find it, but I believe that when Garen's ult had its cooldown increased the reasoning cited was along the lines that Riot thought it was unfair for a champion to have his ultimate back up when his opponent gets back to lane after killing him with it.

Now it's been brought up earlier in this thread that Garen is resourceless while Darius has mana which makes comparing the skills different. But even other champions that use mana or energy still have cooldowns on their ultimate. In fact, I could be wrong on this, but with the exception of transformation ultimates I think Darius is the only one whose ultimate is immediately refreshed after a fight (assuming you kill with it...but I think it's a fair assumption that if your using it then you are going for the execute).

So he appears to be the exception to Riot's design philosophy and I was wondering if you could shed some light on to why that is?


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Wrosgar

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Senior Member

11-30-2012

My problem is I have recently played a Darius game and a Garen game with the same runes and masteries recently. Darius was able to win lane and do noticeably more ult damage with less items then when I was with Garen, and Garen brought a lot less effectiveness to the team then Darius. I have ZERO reason to ever pick Garen in his current state... EVER over Darius.


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KRYPTØNITE

Senior Member

11-30-2012

Everyone knows that a guillotine resets faster than a "justice system".


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Jesus the Friend

Member

12-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by EyeMtheStron9est View Post
omg @ saying two champs that are mirrors of eachother are not comparible.
omg.
This.


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Lynch

Senior Member

12-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Griftrix View Post
You forgot to include Katarina, she also spins. And don't forget to include Draven, he has a move speed increase, and so does Garen. The 2 champs are different and also have a different play feel. You equally play against them differently. I still maintain that it is a useless exercise to compare the power of ults of 2 different champions. If you want to compare the power of champions, you have to look at the entire kit to be fair. Utility, scaling, base stats, cooldowns, mana costs, damage, damage types, movespeed, etc.
I can't believe that the most ****ing retarded thing I've ever read on these forums was posted by a Red.


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tempname1032

Senior Member

02-08-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lynch View Post
I can't believe that the most ****ing retarded thing I've ever read on these forums was posted by a Red.
bump for exposure


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Slamcore

Senior Member

02-08-2013

This was a good thread. Except for 20 pages in the middle before there was any Riot game designer response, I have read the whole thing.

It is indeed paradoxical that Darius large true damage execute ultimate is resettable and on a short cooldown and has a low mana cost.