Zed discussion thread, above average champ.

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Handsome Aniki

Senior Member

11-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avatar ┴ang View Post
Sorry but Zed is nothing like Lee. Not even close.

Lee will chase you down and finish you off. Lee will Resonating Strike and Safeguard through walls and across the map to get you. You cannot escape Lee.

Zed only gets one chance to kill you. If you escape, you're gone and there's nothing he can do about it.
Did you even read the entire post, or did you --like some people-- stop because you read something your eyes found offensive?

In the entire post I probably said Zed is a horrible chaser at least a dozen times, hell in this thread alone it's been stated he can't chase very well.

Conceptually his moves are similar to Lee's. A long range Q, relatively slow skill shot, a W used for wall hopping or engaging, an E that deals AOE damage and slows.

I don't know who salted your salad but if you're going to sound like a jerk in your post at least read everything written here thus far.


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SinRG

Senior Member

11-15-2012

Quote:
I don't know who salted your salad
This genuinely made me LOL XD


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OSWaterJam

Junior Member

11-15-2012

After playing Zed some more I only find his very early game weak. In those early, pre-minion, ganks I find I do very little damage as Zed. Once I get a dorran and Brut I find I start to pack a punch.

One problem I have is keeping track of my shadow in team fights. It is very easy for 2 or 3 people to be right on top of it and I lose track of it. I think once I get more used to the mechanic it will be easier.


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DadimPregnant

Senior Member

11-15-2012

In lane level q and w. 1 into e at level 4. by lvl 8 you will no longer fear tossing out the shadow just to poke. I thought because of the low AD at that level it wouldn't be as beneficial to level w.... i was dead wrong.

Edit. skip the dorans blades. youll thank me later. brut lvl 3-5 is disturbingly effective. and the cdr

Great champ. all the energy users are. a kennen/akali/shen/zed/any team is destructive as hell


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lm Krueger ml

Senior Member

11-15-2012

Overall a pretty good breakdown of Zed from the OP.

My own experience has found only one or two issues so far and they're not anything too critical.

I'd personally suggest a couple of slight upgrades to Zeds kit:

- a better energy regen mechanic.
- increase shadow duration to 5 seconds.
- grant a decaying MS buff to his swap skills.

First and most importantly is his energy regen. I seriously think this is an issue. He doesn't actually have a way of regaining energy. He only has a way of making a couple of his skill casts cheaper providing you hit correctly with them. If you're in a team fight, even if you play it perfectly and hit all of your double strikes for energy regen, manage not to die and use your nukes while your shadows are up, you will still run out of energy as soon as your shadows go down and you are forced to continue the fight without them. Even if you only E to get your shadow back up faster, by the time its back up you'll be dry.

To me a resource mechanic should be something a good player can manage and therefore not run out of if they play well. Especially if we're talking about energy. But Zed feels more like he runs off a mana bar that can regen when he's out of combat. Even at the best case you'll run dry in a prolonged fight, its only a matter of time. He simply can't regen it as fast as he uses it, even with limited and staggered use of abilities. This feels wrong.

I'm not certain how I'd fix it, maybe allowing the energy return to proc multiple times in one cast? So hitting 2 targets with both shurikens in one cast would actually regen more energy than hitting just one. This would effectively let him refill his energy every time his shadow comes back up in a team fight, but that feels too easy and brainless. He wants a way of regening energy that still rewards skilled play but that does actually allow him to regen his energy and not just use it up slightly slower.

Second is an issue with his shadow durations. I find too often that you're highly likely to get silenced or stunned and almost definitely slowed during an engagement. Even if you plan ahead and place a shadow as you engage so you can nuke -> escape, you'll only have about 2seconds before a stun hits you or you get silenced and the clone will vanish before you're able to use the swap. This leaves you totally and utterly screwed more often than not. Increasing the duration to 5seconds instead of 4 would make things far, far easier. I can understand though if people think this would detract from what makes Zed hard to play. Also it makes it harder to counter him which isn't necessarily a good thing.

Finally, if you're swapping with your clone it usually means you either want to chase something or run away from something. But he's often slowed and doesn't have easy access to MS bonuses through items (may change in S3) meaning he really suffers in this department. Whether he's running to or away he find its pretty hard, but giving a short (2-3second) MS steroid when he switches with any shadow will sync with his kit very nicely. I'm thinking something similar to how Jayce gets one when he switches form. A very brief burst that degrades over time, nothing too huge but it will help wonders to make sure you get that chase or escape properly.


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Handsome Aniki

Senior Member

11-15-2012

Check the front page for a glass-cannon build that capitalizes on Zed's ultimate. As well as leveling build I'm currently testing.


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Nocte Prime

Senior Member

11-15-2012

Nice breakdown, +1 even though I disagree with you that he's potentially OP. He's too reliant on his W to do anything, and it has too long a CD and too short a range. If I were Riot, I'd consider moving some of his power from the passive on his W to the rest of his kit to help his early and mid game.

The two big things I think Riot should at least look at with him are his movement speed, and his energy costs/regen. I wouldn't mind seeing some damage front loaded onto his Ult either.

I personally think he's slightly on the weak side. Yes, his late game potential is there due to the passive on his W, but getting to that late game is always going to be more difficult for him than other assassins.


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Itonus

Senior Member

11-15-2012

i feel like he is lack luster, just like elise. riot is really concerned about releasing champions too strong so they make them weaker than they planned to see how they fair and then buff later. a fed zed is not nearly as strong as 60+ other champions. he can't bang with the best of them in the top lane. in the mid lane he really only excels vs melee ap champions with little to no cc. tanky AP mids will continually beat him in lane as well as strong poke champions.

and in comparison to the other energy class champions he has the lowest regeneration or refund of energy for such high costs. the concept is cool, and the ulitiy to get to the back line is there and if played correctly can win teamfights just on that alone, but there are a ton of assasins that can do that already and better.

he is much like elise, untargetable gap close into burst. and just like her, he is released a little too weak in my opinion. and half the time when you use your ulitmate the proc isn't utilized because the target is usually dead by that point. i feel he needs work. higher base stats and lower energy costs to really be a top pick.

EDIT: I realize that this may change for s3 with the new items and all might make him more viable. but i still believe (as he currently is) he is outscaled by so many other champions. you want someone who can gapclose and kill an adc really quick? pick irelia, not only can she do that but she has the survivability to walk away after she jumps to the back line.


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Handsome Aniki

Senior Member

11-15-2012

Bump for justice.


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Sothars

Junior Member

11-15-2012

I dont know why people pick up CDR boots with Brut when he has energy regeneration problems. I'm not sure I see the wisdom in his skills being up quicker but not having the energy to use them.