The Swain issue aside - The mechanics however

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Flow n Crash

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Member

10-06-2010

This is not about the issues of Swain not keeping his old Torment mechanic but rather about the policy You, Riot, have in regards to not-so-easy mechanics/tooltips.

I can see how you want to keep things easy for the casual player but does that really mean you have to keep it at a kindergarden level for everything? Using Swain as an example; He costs 6300 IP which used to mean there was something extra to learn about the champ before you could master it. Even though it ends up even when it comes to maths with the old Torment it still doesn't mean it's the better choice just because it's easy to understand.

Comparing this to the similar effect of Maledict in DotA, sure some people wouldn't understand exactly how it worked straight away but would eventually get it and up with the "wow that's cool! (and fun)". Shouldn't that also be a goal? To make your spells and abilities fun? Mechanics can and does do that but not when you hinder the progression by keeping everything simple and easy. "Applies a damage over time effect which increases the more damage the target takes during this effect." Is that really so hard to grasp? I think not.

This is likely why many of the people seeing this as the LoL-Maledict wanted Swain in the first place. Me included. There are examples of several abilities present that are in fact somewhat complex although everything is relative right? The first thing that comes to mind, perhaps not really complex but excessive nonetheless; Morde's ulti. Remember how many times you were going to read the full description but decided to do it another time because of the wall of text exploding in your face? Pick a Card easy for new players? Maybe. Gragas' Drunken rage has several effects; 1 second channel - even mediocre players forget this, mana gain during channel, increased damage after channeling AND reduced damage. That's 4 things in 1 ability to consider and this is supposed to be relatively easier to understand or remember as a new player than a simple "toss this spell then do another and the first will do more"?

I ended up not listing any other abilities because of the simple reason that if you think the old Torment mechanic was complex then half of the abilities in this game are also too complex. There are abilities with several effects, perhaps 3 or 4, that at first glance you won't remember until after using it a while or reading the tooltip several times. There are abilities with effects that makes you have to calculate wether or not it's actually useful building one way or another or how to level up your abilities.

TL;DR - There are complexities of all sorts already present. The Torment mechanic wasn't more or less complex than most that are in the game already. Worst thing about all of this is that even though we have 60+ champs now, Riot is still afraid to use "complex" mechanics because new players should be able to understand it the second they read the tooltip.

Riot, do please reconsider your thoughts on this. In my opinion, you are preventing yourselves from making your game alot more fun than it already is.

EDIT: I noticed people seem hung up on Swain and his Torment alone while I was trying to make my point regarding the game as a whole. Swain's Torment is just the latest example available. As the first reply says; Anivia and her mechanics would probably not work the way they do or be allowed at all would Riot apply the same policy as with Swain's Torment and that goes for alot of other champs/abilities and it should not be this way in my opinion.


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Lord GiantR

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Senior Member

10-06-2010

Anivia would NEVER be allowed to be put in the game is she was made now.

Kinda Sad really.


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TechpriestJadoko

Senior Member

10-06-2010

I'm almost 100% sure that, if they kept Torment the way it was, it really wouldn't make the game more or less fun. It'd just make that ONE ability different.

As far as I can tell (I really don't care that much for him), the change to his Torment was now instead of ALL damage adding to the DoT, only HIS damage adds to the DoT. That...really isn't that huge of a deal.


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Zack1996

Senior Member

10-06-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by TechpriestJadoko View Post
I'm almost 100% sure that, if they kept Torment the way it was, it really wouldn't make the game more or less fun. It'd just make that ONE ability different.

As far as I can tell (I really don't care that much for him), the change to his Torment was now instead of ALL damage adding to the DoT, only HIS damage adds to the DoT. That...really isn't that huge of a deal.
Maledict vs. Random DoT spell.

Massive difference.


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Knote

Senior Member

10-06-2010

Guess this means I'll never have my Windrunner equivalent in this game. I'm sad. =/


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Heathenl

Senior Member

10-06-2010

Prices are based on production cost.


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ObeDearDabbin

Member

10-06-2010

did they already nerf him ? :|


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Flow n Crash

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10-06-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by TechpriestJadoko View Post
I'm almost 100% sure that, if they kept Torment the way it was, it really wouldn't make the game more or less fun. It'd just make that ONE ability different.

As far as I can tell (I really don't care that much for him), the change to his Torment was now instead of ALL damage adding to the DoT, only HIS damage adds to the DoT. That...really isn't that huge of a deal.
It seems you fail to see the point of my entire thread. One ability mechanic won't make or break a game. However the principle applies to ALL abilities. Did you not understand that?


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Lord GiantR

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Senior Member

10-06-2010

I will bump this. We NEED more interesting abilities. His ult was interesting but nothing else was


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Twigg

Senior Member

10-06-2010

Bump for great justice


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