Statikk Discusses Preseason Jungle Changes

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Zeddanker

Member

11-09-2012

I am interested in seeing how Singed will handle the new jungle and how well he will synergize with the new items. Any insight on that Statikk?


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R4v3n Cl4w

Junior Member

11-09-2012

we need another cool map so we can jungle more


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Sabrestrike

Senior Member

11-09-2012

There's a pretty good chance the mage equivalent item won't be too mandatory in lane because of the likelihood it will provide armor.


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Dem Squats

Senior Member

11-09-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by StBenedict View Post
So it sounds like they took away leashing since the monster will just attack the closet champion, no more super easy clears.
So have the mid hit it a few more times for the jungler? People really are crying about this, please stay out of the jungle if you think this change is "game breaking" because you were not good enough to handle it to begin with.


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kkjk

Junior Member

11-09-2012

Now, I have several questions about these jungle changes.
1. Your changes to "early ganking" seems harmful to many junglers, such as Lee Sin. His jungling is almost primarily based on a successful level 2 gank to gain him some early money (and items) and the lane early dominance, so removing this from him would slow him down, not to a huge degree but enough to hurt. Now, although Lee Sin can continue farming and skip his level 2 gank, this completely changes the playstyle around him. How can (Lee Sin and others) players counter this need for early ganks since it is almost a necessity on them to maintain their role and current playstyle as a jungler that goes for early game dominance and not completely late game "beastliness"?
2. You say you want to reduce "lane pressure" from junglers that constantly gank, yet this would hurt the constantly ganking junglers, say Shaco. Currently, Shaco is almost completely gank based, he can farm the jungle but that is weak and ineffective on him. Certain junglers not only need but thrive off of this lane pressure and ganking, so how would removing it affect them and how can this change be countered on them?
3. The changes to the early game damage of jungle creeps frightens me, as you say you want early ganking junglers to be weaker and less able to gank, but what about the non early gankers? Say for example Rammus. Although he is capable of a level 2 gank with his powerball, the way I play him I farm until level four to get his taunt, recall, and then go for ganks as already his sustain to reach level 4 without dieing or recalling is quite pitiful. But now with increased damage from the camps (not to mention the damage from no leash) and less health on the jungler to counter early ganks, you are also countering early sustain, forcing junglers such as Rammus (at least the way I play him) to recall sooner, fall behind in levels, gank later, and overall becomeless useful in the early and mid game, the area of the game where a jungler shines the most in granting his team an early lead.
Please reply Statikk, and if you do, the examples I have used (Lee Sin, Shaco, and Rammus) do not need to be mentioned as I rarely play Lee Sin and have never played Shaco (but i intend to), they were simply mentioned out of my knowledge of the game and their current playstyles, as there is more than just "ganking jungler" and "tanky jungler" when it comes to jungle roles, yet your changes mentioned seemed to be aimed at specifically these two without much consideration of the others (not saying there wasn't consideration, it just doesn't seem like it). Thank you.


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Arächnophobia

Member

11-09-2012

So Sejuani is going to be worse than she is now.
Her early clears are already bad...cmon man D: Shes no where near 'other tank jungles' for early clears, other tank jungles have an easy time, just compare amumu jungling to her D;!


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BobHacket

Junior Member

11-09-2012

Making the Jungles lower health so they can't gank is all fine and dandy but I feel like this is going to open lanes into venturing into the jungle to kill low lifed junglers.... not good/bad just an observation will be interesting yet frustrating as a jungler


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CartoonMad

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Senior Member

11-09-2012

Jungle teemo will rise to this occasion!


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igeel

Junior Member

11-09-2012

Brush size so big and so many, you should reduce that. And make wards is last longer if plant in brush so they higly effective.


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Phaetox

Member

11-09-2012

Statikk,

Thank you so much for being actively involved in this thread. It is always nice to see Riot staff answering questions that the community offers up. You have earned much respect from the League community.

I'm very pleased with most of these changes and cannot give any negative feedback without first seeing the actual repercussions of the changes.

I'm happy to see that Riot has acknowledged the fact that the Blue team has certain strategic advantages, such as their duo lane getting an early XP advantage via mini golem camp, and is taking strides to even the playing field.

I was originally concerned that these changes would make junglers like Shyvana and Dr. Mundo completely nonviable due to their lack of sustain. You have addressed that concern in one of your many response posts though.

I think it is a good change to relieve early game jungle pressure, as it allows for more diversity in play style and itemization for all lanes, including junglers. Also excited to see the new items.

Melee Carries really had no role in competitive play due to their lack of a suitable environment. I remember in S1 when Master Yi, Tryndamere, and others would jungle because it was a safe place to farm gold to ensure they would carry later on. It is nice to see an increase in gold / XP benefits. I felt that champions like Nocturne had fallen out of favor and maybe these changes will help bring them back onto the scene.

The quality of life change to make it easier to pull Dragon out of its den is a huge plus! I'm happy to see that Riot has been paying attention to less noticeable aspects of detailed game mechanics. I am also glad to see the increase in how much a Mid laner has to commit to get wraiths.

I feel a lot of people think that Riot has removed parts of the games that we had grown accustomed to but this is certainly not the case in my opinion. Bot lane can still get golems, mid can still get wraiths / wolves, junglers can still gank HOWEVER Riot has increased the skill cap for junglers based on strategic clears and giving those who have superior decision making processes more benefits for their more skilled performances. With these changes, the mid laner can't just grab wraiths whenever. They have to make sure they plan in advance to do so by positioning the lane properly and timing their sideline quests so that they don't miss out on mid farm. I feel Riot has balanced a lot of the issues in the game that I had noticed. It was too high reward for low risk in many scenarios and now players will have to make conscious decisions and their choices will impact their overall performance to where smarter players will shine.

I also see some AD carries that have good mobility / range going Droan's Blade first when laning with a healer or something similar to this scenario. This opens up more diversity in play style for the bot lane as well.

I'm completely thrilled to see new AP jungle items to benefit Diana, FIddlesticks, and others. Also 100% stoked to play Jungle Malzahar

As a player who has had this game installed since the very beginning of S1, I'm very pleasantly surprised by these tweaks and by your commitment as a Riot employee to please the community and respond to concerns. Kudos to you good sir.