Swain, the Master Tactician - Champion Spotlight

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SKT T1 Kush

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10-06-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedSatyr View Post
The tactic involved is, from what I see, using is root/slow abilities in a group fight to obliterate the opposition. So, it's not what he does on his own, but how he is involved in a group fight. For instance, using the root and slow to keep everyone in range of Nunu's ult kind of involves tactics. I'm not sure why everyone is all, "this guy is not made of tactics, his abilities don't tactfully tactic everyone to death".
No, it is not that. It is the fact that his only tactical skill is easy to dodge. That, and the fact that with the title "Master Tactician" he should be tactical character, yet he's not tactical at all. He's a solo-laner, who can focus one champ and that's about it. Sure he has an AoE snare, but then, if he wants to get that close, let's just focus him and watch him die in seconds.


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Cagaiver

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Senior Member

10-06-2010

Thanks for the subtitles...


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RedSatyr

Senior Member

10-06-2010

If he were to have only snares and roots and slows.... he'd be fantastic in groups, but kinda useless on his own. He would then NEED to be on bottom in 3s and on either bottom/top for 5s. He would also be a very crappy champion if he depended on being carried so much. I just don't see why everyone is griping about him. Of course this will all be forgetting when there is a new champion to complain about...


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SKT T1 Kush

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10-06-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedSatyr View Post
If he were to have only snares and roots and slows.... he'd be fantastic in groups, but kinda useless on his own. He would then NEED to be on bottom in 3s and on either bottom/top for 5s. He would also be a very crappy champion if he depended on being carried so much. I just don't see why everyone is griping about him. Of course this will all be forgetting when there is a new champion to complain about...
That is the definitive of tactician my friend. One who does not work alone, but leads others in such a way that their performance will increase beyond what it would have normally been. A tactician is a leader, and a supporter, not a solo laner who does nothing for the rest of the team but act as another mage.
I understand that we just had a support champ come out, but seriously, just change the name. All they are doing is disappointing the players by creating a character who's abilities, personality, and title clash.


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XiTro

Member

10-06-2010

his ratios are too low, i find him underpowered.

not going to play him anymore.


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alclarity

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10-06-2010

Im pretty sure they don't, but does anyone know if when there is only one hero around, and Swain's ult is level 3, will all three ravens keep hitting that hero or only one raven at a time. I really hope all three attack the same target or he is gimp.

Also, what happened to Torment being a Damage over Time spell that magnifies damage dealt into the DoT damage after every tick? Wasn't it suppose to make each Torment tick do more damage based on a percent of the amount of damage received subsequential to each tick? I dunno, like Maledict in DotA?


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Vwolfe

Junior Member

10-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by alclarity View Post
Also, what happened to Torment being a Damage over Time spell that magnifies damage dealt into the DoT damage after every tick? Wasn't it suppose to make each Torment tick do more damage based on a percent of the amount of damage received subsequential to each tick? I dunno, like Maledict in DotA?
This, so ****ing this.

Swain is lower tier than pretty much ever other caster and lacks a truly unique spell of any kind because of this change in the mechanic.

Up vote if you want Torment to mirror Maledict again.


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RedSatyr

Senior Member

10-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Isaniac View Post
That is the definitive of tactician my friend. One who does not work alone, but leads others in such a way that their performance will increase beyond what it would have normally been. A tactician is a leader, and a supporter, not a solo laner who does nothing for the rest of the team but act as another mage.
I understand that we just had a support champ come out, but seriously, just change the name. All they are doing is disappointing the players by creating a character who's abilities, personality, and title clash.
Ok, let me just point out that all I am saying, is that you and many others are taking it way too seriously. Karthus is "The Deathsinger", but he doesn't sing now does he? Kog'maw is "The Mouth of the Abyss", implying a endless apitite, yet he is constantly vomiting on champions. My point is made, I'm done.


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Tsachaq

Member

10-07-2010

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Originally Posted by NessOnett View Post
I think you grossly underestimate the tactical complexities that Torment offers. At least as much as a game like this can. Different situations will require entirely different approaches to the fight and skill order as opposed to someone like Annie who goes R>Q>W>E>Q with very little variation about 99% of the time. Not to mention that toggling and low-CD ults are very important to strategize with(see: kassadin).

But it all comes back to the game, honestly, name any champ that requires anything more than a day to become viable and effective with. It's hard, because the game is made in such a way that characters like that don't exist. They tried with Ezreal, and he became one of the easiest champs to master. But the combination of torment, delayed "skillshot" and a toggleable ult that AOEs outward from himself(so he needs to be able to position well) is about as tactically complex as this game has to offer. You want more micro, go play SCII.
By your standard every other Champ should be a "Master Tactician", especially the nukers (spell casters) where possibilities of "tactical complexities" is limitless (depending on the level of the player). And one can't be designated a "Master Tactician" based on the difficulty of using his abilities. That's absurd reasoning. The point we are making is not the Level of Difficulty but the Synergy of the Champ's title/background and his skills. Nothing more. I'd agree to call him a Tactician if he has skills like, say,
Battle Tactic : His experience in the battlefield allows him to direct his allies to coordinate better in a fight. (Effect: buffed Champs receive increased crit [or whatever] chance for every additional ally Champ nearby)
Auxiliary Troops : Calls forth his reserve minions. (Effect: summons additional minions that can help push towers or assist in team fights)
etc. etc. [made those up as i wrote so I'm not up for debate on those abilities]

In the case of Swain - no correlation b/w his title/background and his abilities. These are the finer things that lore lovers would understand/appreciate. You have a right to your opinion, we have ours.


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Mordrogar

Junior Member

10-07-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedSatyr View Post
Ok, let me just point out that all I am saying, is that you and many others are taking it way too seriously. Karthus is "The Deathsinger", but he doesn't sing now does he? Kog'maw is "The Mouth of the Abyss", implying a endless apitite, yet he is constantly vomiting on champions. My point is made, I'm done.
I thought Kog's title was "The Overpowered Right-Clicker" and Karthus "The Pentakill AFK"

And yeah, Swain is NOT top tier. He's powerful early/mid game when laning, pretty much useless later on.

It's sad that every new character Riot produces that is not an uncharismatic big-boobed b*tch is useless past the 20mn mark. Swain = Urgot, awesome style, rapes face at the beginning, makes your team lose at the end.