Welcome to the Forum Archive!

Years of conversation fill a ton of digital pages, and we've kept all of it accessible to browse or copy over. Whether you're looking for reveal articles for older champions, or the first time that Rammus rolled into an "OK" thread, or anything in between, you can find it here. When you're finished, check out the boards to join in the latest League of Legends discussions.

GO TO BOARDS


Trolls, trolls everywhere

12
Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

VG Bustamoov

Senior Member

11-03-2012

Quote:
PogoPogoPogoPogo:
Yes, it's true that as you start to approach your proper Elo, games become difficult (or impossible) to single-handedly carry.

But if you're truly better than the people at the Elo you're at and truly belong at a higher Elo, you can make sure you're dominating at least your lane every match.

Sometimes your other lanes will feed, and you'll lose. Sometimes, your other lanes will get fed and your whole team will just easily roll. It goes back and forth sure, but as long as you're playing consistently well and making sure you win your lane every time, you'll have a positive W/L rate and you'll slowly gain Elo.


This is not true for the players like me, who end up with a support role because i can't type as fast as these kids. As soon as the screen loads up, everyone is 'calling' thier lanes. If you are 1st pick and want a lane that someone else 'called'..they feed, or AFK. So, as a result, the Support CANNOT carry a team to victory under any circumstances. I have had Sona at 5/0/26 and still lost because we had 2 lanes feeding. Elo hell is REAL and a support player cannot get out on thier own.
I've had teammates that will pick Ashe after the enemy has chosen Ezreal. I have games where no one wants to jungle so we have 3 mid, no top and no jungle. I've had 35% AFK, at least 25% feeders (and I mean 0/10+) and the rest...dunno what to say. How does someone who plays support win games when your teammates know nothing about picking into thier opponents strengths, or not counterpicking? Who would pick Darius when Teemo is already chosen for the opposing team? Why do these people only play 1 role and play ranked? And in that 1 role, they have 1 champ they are decent with. I can play any support and a lot of hybrid supports (Nidalee, Lux, Maokai, etc) but supports don't win or lose games. I can help win a lane, but if my ADC sux, then it makes my job that much harder to just try to stay even with the lane, much less watch as mid, top or jungle just feeds.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

11-03-2012

Quote:
Nycterra:
This is not true for the players like me, who end up with a support role

This is where I stopped reading, because it's still true.

Think about it, if you're good enough to play support in the 1600 bracket, but your Elo is 1100, then it's a 1600 support + 1100 ADC in lane against 1100 ADC and 1100 support. You'll win more matches than you lose.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

VG Bustamoov

Senior Member

11-03-2012

Quote:
PogoPogoPogoPogo:
This is where I stopped reading, because it's still true.

Think about it, if you're good enough to play support in the 1600 bracket, but your Elo is 1100, then it's a 1600 support + 1100 ADC in lane against 1100 ADC and 1100 support. You'll win more matches than you lose.


Granted...I 'DO' win the bot lane more often than not, but its not the bot lane that is the problem. It's the OTHER lanes. A fail jungler who never ganks, or gets killed when he does. a feeder in any lane, or multiple lanes. I haven't had a decent team in over 20 games. Even a 1600 Support with an 100 ADC vs. an 1100 ADC/1100 Support is screwed if thier jungler ganks often and/or your ADC counterpicks himself. I've also noticed that NO ONE EVER buys wards...EVER!!!! I'm the only one who buys wards and since I get no cs, I just spend all my gold on wards and still get harrassed for not having wards everywhere. since when is the support the only one who is supposed to buy wards?


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

adc

Member

11-03-2012

Quote:
PogoPogoPogoPogo:
This is where I stopped reading, because it's still true.

Think about it, if you're good enough to play support in the 1600 bracket, but your Elo is 1100, then it's a 1600 support + 1100 ADC in lane against 1100 ADC and 1100 support. You'll win more matches than you lose.


But you're assuming everyone is equally good at all roles. I personally excel at AD carry, am pretty good at mid lane, mediocre at top, and my jungle and support are comparatively atrocious. I play AD carry better than most 1450s I play against - but I wouldn't play support in a 1200 game and expect to do quite well.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

11-03-2012

Quote:
AD Bottom:
But you're assuming everyone is equally good at all roles. I personally excel at AD carry, am pretty good at mid lane, mediocre at top, and my jungle and support are comparatively atrocious. I play AD carry better than most 1450s I play against - but I wouldn't play support in a 1200 game and expect to do quite well.

If you notice, I said if you're good enough to play support in the 1600 bracket and you're playing in the 1100 bracket as support, etc. I didn't say if you're a 1600 ADC playing as a support in 1100.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

11-03-2012

Quote:
Nycterra:
Granted...I 'DO' win the bot lane more often than not, but its not the bot lane that is the problem. It's the OTHER lanes. A fail jungler who never ganks, or gets killed when he does. a feeder in any lane, or multiple lanes. I haven't had a decent team in over 20 games. Even a 1600 Support with an 100 ADC vs. an 1100 ADC/1100 Support is screwed if thier jungler ganks often and/or your ADC counterpicks himself. I've also noticed that NO ONE EVER buys wards...EVER!!!! I'm the only one who buys wards and since I get no cs, I just spend all my gold on wards and still get harrassed for not having wards everywhere. since when is the support the only one who is supposed to buy wards?

The other 9 players in your match are going to average out to be equal in the long run. If you're a 1600 support, your team has a 1600 support in every single match. Meanwhile, if your Elo is 1100, then the average skill level of every other player in your matches is 1100.

Will you win every match? No. Like you say, sometimes you get a bad jungler and their jungler camps your lane. Some times you get the short end of the stick on junglers. Sometimes your mid and top feed. But it happens both ways and tends to cancel itself out in the long run.

The biggest difference will be seen in the matches where the lanes are pretty even, top, mid and jungle. Your excellent support play helps get your ADC fed and your lane makes the difference in the match. This is where the positive win-rate comes in.


Nycterra, a few tips I have for your specific case...

1) Don't lose more than 2 ranked matches in a row. What this means is, if you lose a ranked match then queue up and lose another, take a break. Don't queue up for ranked until you've had a bit of a break. Sometimes bad teammates or simply just losing will put you in a bad mood. Then, even if the next game is winnable, you're kind of "on tilt" as they might say and not playing at your best.

2) Maybe stop playing as Nidalee? You have quite a few games with her recently, you've got mixed results. But what troubles me most is your build with her is drastically inconsistent. Like, very oddly inconsistently varies.

3) Get some practice with a wide variety of supports. Sona seems to be your best champion in ranked play, but you have 0 ranked matches with other good supports like Nunu, Alistar, Taric, etc.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

VG Bustamoov

Senior Member

11-04-2012

Quote:
PogoPogoPogoPogo:
The other 9 players in your match are going to average out to be equal in the long run. If you're a 1600 support, your team has a 1600 support in every single match. Meanwhile, if your Elo is 1100, then the average skill level of every other player in your matches is 1100.

Will you win every match? No. Like you say, sometimes you get a bad jungler and their jungler camps your lane. Some times you get the short end of the stick on junglers. Sometimes your mid and top feed. But it happens both ways and tends to cancel itself out in the long run.

The biggest difference will be seen in the matches where the lanes are pretty even, top, mid and jungle. Your excellent support play helps get your ADC fed and your lane makes the difference in the match. This is where the positive win-rate comes in.


Nycterra, a few tips I have for your specific case...

1) Don't lose more than 2 ranked matches in a row. What this means is, if you lose a ranked match then queue up and lose another, take a break. Don't queue up for ranked until you've had a bit of a break. Sometimes bad teammates or simply just losing will put you in a bad mood. Then, even if the next game is winnable, you're kind of "on tilt" as they might say and not playing at your best.

2) Maybe stop playing as Nidalee? You have quite a few games with her recently, you've got mixed results. But what troubles me most is your build with her is drastically inconsistent. Like, very oddly inconsistently varies.

3) Get some practice with a wide variety of supports. Sona seems to be your best champion in ranked play, but you have 0 ranked matches with other good supports like Nunu, Alistar, Taric, etc.


I've been following Guides and Video's on Nidalee. The builds vary dependant on what your lane has. Sometimes, when my bot lane counterpicked himself, I have to build fast AP to help. Other times, I'm building Mana Regen and G/10. Last game, I 'called' support and picked Nidalee because I saw a Darius and Caitlyn picked and I counter them both. Put in my Support Masteries and Runes and ran to get a cup of coffee (was 2nd pick). I come back, the game is in the loading screen and I see a Soraka. Then i see a Fizz, Ashe and Diana. We have no tank. We have an ADC that picked into Caitlyns strength. Teemo counter Nidalee hard, but Nidalee counters Darius.
The lanes ended up with me having to top, Fizz mid, Diana jungle, Soraka/Ashe bot.
Teemo was top and Darius was mid. Darius promptly got fed off of Fizz (He wouldn't switch lanes with me). I held 0/0/0 until about the 15 minute mark when Amumu, Darius and Caitlyn joined Teemo (With no MIA) for a 4 man gank from front and behind. From there, it went south fast. Darius continued to feed off of Fizz and soraka and I kept losing ground top against teemo and the constant ganks from Amumu and roaming of Darius. I ended up 0/5/5. Yeah...I think I would have done much better swapping places with Fizz and laning against Darius, but Fizz was adamant that he was mid. Diana did very well at first, but rarely ganked top (I saw twice - both failed). Fizz ended up 1/11/4, Soraka ended up 0/9/3, Diana was 9/3/5 and Ashe was 2/7/2. Considering I had 'Support' runes and Masteries and was against a Teemo (Nidalee counter), I thought I did rather well to hold my lane as long as I did.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

VG Bustamoov

Senior Member

11-04-2012

Just to set the record...I've dodged 4 times already tonight...making me sit out for almost 3 hours due to troll teams. As I drop in elo, the teams get WORSE!! I have no idea how that happens, but there are more and more trolls as I descend, so it seems hopeless that I'll ever get out.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

PogoPogoPogoPogo

Senior Member

11-04-2012

As you drop in Elo, the ENEMY teams get worse too.

I don't know what Elo you're actually at right now, but.... counter picks don't mean as much as I think you think they do. You might benefit simply from learning a few champs really well and only playing them in ranked. Pick a champ, play like 50 matches with them in normal, then go to ranked with them.


12