creep score importance

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Dyuan

Member

01-03-2013

Hi, I am an experienced hon/dota2 player trying to get into league of legends, I have a few questions about the importance of creep score in league.

I did some research and most people say they average around 80/10m 150/20m and is a pretty standard thing.

However, in nearly every game I play, Its rare to see anyone accomplish that sort of CS.

Ranked or normal, I more often see 50/10m 100/25m on my teammates, and me being the only person to accomplish that kind of cs.

A big problem I always run into, often times, when I'm farming
-my team initiates 4v5 without waiting for me
-someone gets caught out of position and starts a teamfight
-force unnecessary fights(half hp, oom, tower is almost dead)


I'm not an idiot that afk farms the whole game and ignores my team, but it really seems like CS doesn't matter at all and it's always my fault, even when I'm carrying hard, winning or losing. People always have an excuse to die and have low cs.

I have 3 years of dota experience, and I'm around 1800mmr in hon, and it just seems as CS doesn't pay off as much in league, and the teams are heavier to carry.

Now my question, should I be more team oriented, miss out on CS and become more of a team oriented player?

Because to me, 99% of the times, it just seems like my teammates aren't time efficient, they have bad map awareness and are always in bad positions.

Are these type of players, decisions, and bad plays only in the lower elo brackets/normal?

Or am I just being delusional, and overestimating myself?

I don't believe in elo hell at all, I'm still relatively new to the game, and I just want to know if I'm going towards the right direction in learning and improving myself.

Constructive comments only please.

a few of my high cs/carry games
http://img1.uploadscreenshot.com/ima...22551-orig.png


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r3lic

Member

01-03-2013

Damn noticed a 1h43 min game in there, that's nuts. You'll usually see 100-150 cs in most games and that'll suffice. Granted that could get higher the longer the game goes but on an average of 25-30 min games that's more than enough. Once towers start going down, it becomes a lot less about farming and more about team fights. I would only find myself farming at this point if im behind, teammates are dead or the other team is visible and split up.


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RiTenga

Junior Member

01-03-2013

You shouldn't have to choose between team fights and cs, team fights will always be more important because killing someone on the other team isn't just that, it's a window to accomplish some short/long term goals such as farming, dragon/baron, most importantly turrets. Destroying turrets gives your whole team gold plus the other team loses for the entire game. Farming is important though but if your team is ready for fighting you'll be much more useful aiding the team than farming for gold and getting items later on. Think about farming, you're just doing it to buy good items to kill the other team but it won't help if they are already getting fed off of your team.


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What is Studying

Senior Member

01-03-2013

Csing is insanely important for the first 20 minutes of the game. By the 20 minute mark, towers should be falling and teamfights are more important at this point. However, people still need to be getting CS from the lanes quickly and returning back to the team for the next fight.


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Snarglefargen

Member

01-03-2013

If it looks like there might be a teamfight go there. If there are no objectives being contested farm.By the time teamfights start happeing you should be able to one shot minion waves so just shove the lane quickly and run back to your team. Hope this helps and good luck!


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Senior Member

01-03-2013

Just judging by the matches you attached, in my opinion, it seems as though you don't work with your team. There are tons of matches people are in with a Teemo that camps top and just farms the entire game, then they lose. Of course the Teemo goes "I got 500 cs and was 1/1/0, bad team". Summoner's Rift is a lot more team oriented than DotA. Keep in mind that this is my OPINION.


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Keuzen

Senior Member

01-03-2013

You should have a decent amount of CS, but if my team needs help, I will leave my lane to help them or I will help in the fight. I lean more towards my team, but I farm to the best of my ability otherwise.


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Ambrotos

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Member

01-03-2013

A couple comments that are hopefully helpful.

CS is important so don't get away from that, but here is some things I noticed from your defeats that you listed.

In the game with Varus, you don't have any attack speed and Last Whisper is a better item choice on a ranged carry than Black Cleaver because $40% on all of your attacks will cause more damage and there is no ramp up time to get to max armor reduction. Another thing to consider in this game, your CS is mainly important compared to your counterpart on the other team. In this case it was vayne and both of you were at 6 items. I think Vayne is only lacking the boots upgrade. So, you as Varus and Vayne are essentially equally geared going into the team fights of later stages. However, you should've gotten there first with the massive CS and that's when your advantage can win your team the game.

In the game with Garen, the other team essentially has 5 magic dealers. Jax and Warwick are hybrid, but deal magic damage with their abilities. The other 3 (Dr. Mundo, Gragas, Veigar) are all magic damage in this case. You should have at least 1 item with magic resist to help negate their damage. I'm not saying that's why the game was lost, just my opinion on a way to improve.

If you have massive CS and your teammates get melted because they are behind in CS, then the 3v1 or whatever match up it leaves you in is hard to carry.

My overall opinion just from looking at those games, you're doing just fine, but learning the ropes still. League is much different from DotA and HoN and single-handedly carrying/destroying the other team isn't as realistic. As your understanding goes up, so will your win rate as you'll know the right times to join the fights and when not to.


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MileHighJew

Senior Member

01-03-2013

It's not just about your CS. Helping your team gank someone in another lane will help lead to your team mate get back to CS after the enemy died. It also prevents the enemy from getting CS. Of course you can get back to your CS too. It's a team game.

The objective of the game is to destroy the other team's Nexus. CS and kills are just ways to help reach your objective.


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Fate000

Senior Member

01-03-2013

In League, CS is much less important then in DotA or HoN. Basically, no matter how farmed you are, you cannot singlehandedly carry a team. No matter how fed you are, I don't think you can carry a team either (if you are ridiculously fed, the most you can get probably is kill two full-hp enemy champions alone. But there are five on their team, and I'm talking about something like almost-full build, level 18 against level 12's). League has much more focus on fighting (and killing) their champions then killing minions.

That being said, the first phase, Laning, is about killing minions; this phase usually lasts 10-15 minutes or so, afterwards focus on killing their champions or towers.

Speaking of towers, they grant XP and gold to the entire team equally if you kill one. Thus they are priority, no matter how early. I suggest strongly always taking tower over cs, but don't get fired on.

Dragon is similar, but more complicated. Killing towers makes the lane more open, allowing to kill their champions more effectively. However, you must go out of your way to kill the Dragon, unless you're the jungler. The Dragon gives 190 gold to each player in your team, as well as XP to you and nearby allies equally (it is a viable strategy to walk to dragon and help a bit if you're ADC and the jungler is fighting dragon: the XP helps quite a bit!). The gold it gives is equivalent to each lane lasthitting perfectly two minion waves, thus obviously it's a priority target, much more then minions.


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