The new tt is not dominion!!!! Stop it!

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Gabe2

Member

10-26-2012

We are calling it Dominion 2.0 for more than just alters. The gameplay style is closer to dominion than to TT. You have to watch every angle looking for the other team, something that was rare in TT, but happens in the jungle of Dominion. The map is extremely open, just like Dominion, and not so much like TT. The control of the alters is the main objective, and the only one of real importance, just like in Dominion. The speed alter makes the map a lot smaller, even with it's already small layout, similar to Dominion, except more so. There are more shared features with dominion than with Twisted Treeline. The changes to the Twisted Treeline map should have been made in a manner that made the CURRENT Twisted Treeline community happier. What they did was completely change the target audience. The old Twisted Treeline community liked TT because it was a shorter Summoner's Rift with a different jungle, and more emphasis on each individual player.


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Galgus

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Senior Member

10-26-2012

The Altars are an important mechanic in new TT, yes, but they are everything in Dominion.

The entire flow of Dominion is on securing Capture Points, with the Storm Buff and random quests being only minor deviations from this.


The two modes have almost nothing in common in their pacing, Dominion Capture Points are not surrounded by ganker ideal brush, and interrupting an ongoing capture is easier to do on Dominion.


Anyone who thinks the that the two maps have remotely similar pacing should give Dominion another go- this map may have some Dominion-esq elements, but it is still closer to Rift/ TT than Dominion.

(Farming existing only as a byproduct of pushing a lane should make it obvious.)


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Treetop69

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taarki View Post
let me give you some hints why a lot of people think its dominion
In dominion: capture alters(riot calls them turrets somehow) and you win
New TT: capture alters and you win(10% ad/ap boost is OP its like your whole team having a full build with ap and then adding another rabadons as a 7th item or another infinity edge as a 7th on AD
Stop it with the false equivalence

If i pick teemo shaco and twitch and perma camp altars the ENTIRE game do i win? no? you mean i need to kill your nexus with auto attacks to get victory?

well god damn, looks like ITS NOT DOMINION


The only thing your statement proves is that
1) Both dom and TT have passive locations to "control and hold"
2) controlling these locations HELPS to win on TT and is MANDATORY to win on dom
3) it makes TT more snowbally.


TT is not Dom. Stop saying it is. You want a list of valid reasons to hate it?

No wards
Snowbally
Blackfire Torch
Teemo all over the place

took me 2 seconds to come up with 4 reasons. here is 4 more

location of the speed shrine and the uselessness of it
odd locations of brush
the "lane like" layout of the jungle and locations of camps.
the ease of the camps and the gold given

4 seconds and i got 8 legit reasons


but somehow all you idiots can come up with is WAHHHHH IT PLAYS LIKE DOMINION WAHHHHHHHH


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Boagster

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taarki View Post
let me give you some hints why a lot of people think its dominion
In dominion: capture alters(riot calls them turrets somehow) and you win
New TT: capture alters and you win(10% ad/ap boost is OP its like your whole team having a full build with ap and then adding another rabadons as a 7th item or another infinity edge as a 7th on AD
Except the new altars don't capture the same as the Dominion altars (one you have to stand on but can still fight, the other you have to channel at - therefore, no fighting), I've won new TT maps without altar control, and the primary objective is still to destroy turrets and ultimately attack and destroy their Nexus.

Also, calling false equivelancy on your Rabadon's comparison - +10% AP ≠ +30% AP; +10% AP ≠ 140 AP (in any possible situation excluding Veigar farming)

Also, you can't have another Rabadon's. You can't buy a first in new TT.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exqzr View Post
I agree it doesn't play like Dominion. I mean Dominion is better. It does however "feel" like a Dominion game "feels" because its very chaotic.

It just doesn't appeal to me AT ALL. Sorry.
That's probably far less a result of the map and far more a result of nobody being in same book, let alone the same page, as far as strategy goes. Give it time, that will settle down.


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Treetop69

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
We are calling it Dominion 2.0 for more than just alters. The gameplay style is closer to dominion than to TT.
disagreed.
Quote:
You have to watch every angle looking for the other team, something that was rare in TT, but happens in the jungle of Dominion.
it was rare in TT because as long as you put a ward @ the red buff in mid you were almost ungankable. if you DIDNT ward that you got wrecked as soon as you pushed past the 2 mid bushes.
Quote:
The map is extremely open, just like Dominion, and not so much like TT.
false. no more open than TT, less blind corners maybe, but its still got alot of walls.

Quote:
The control of the alters is the main objective, and the only one of real importance, just like in Dominion.
So go camp the altars, meanwhile ill win the game by killing your nexus while your AFK in the jungle thinking you will win automaticly.

because the altars dont do dmg to the nexus, they are NOT the main goal.

Quote:
The speed alter makes the map a lot smaller, even with it's already small layout, similar to Dominion, except more so.
the speed altar buff feels like 5% or less, not a big deal. i played a game as jayce and it speeds you up less than jayces gate.
Quote:
There are more shared features with dominion than with Twisted Treeline.
nope. you just want there to be so you set out to find things that justify your already decided belief.

Quote:
The changes to the Twisted Treeline map should have been made in a manner that made the CURRENT Twisted Treeline community happier.
agreed
Quote:
What they did was completely change the target audience. The old Twisted Treeline community liked TT because it was a shorter Summoner's Rift with a different jungle, and more emphasis on each individual player.
agreed as well.

The changes they did were well intentioned but faulty. Hate it for that reason then.

But please, stop ****ing calling it god damned dominion. ITS NOT


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KotlettDrake

Senior Member

10-26-2012

0 snowball, altars, dominion items, more starting gold, no lane phase? sounds like dominion to me


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Boagster

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Treetop69 View Post
<snip>
You want a list of valid reasons to hate it?

No wards
I actually think this is a pro on such a small map, not a con. I love ward strategy on SR, but I always felt they were almost cheesy on the old TT.

Quote:
Snowbally
The old TT was quite snowbally, too. This just made it worse.

Quote:
Blackfire Torch
I love the concept of Blackfire Torch, but I feel it needs to be toned down a bit. 4% over 4 seconds, maybe?

Quote:
Teemo all over the place
This was bound to happen with the lack of wards, but only because he is the obvious option. Ashe, Nidalee, Shaco, and Caitlyn can all serve the same role on the team, with varying degrees of effectiveness.

Quote:
<snip>
location of the speed shrine and the uselessness of it
The speed shrine is a neutral point with me - take it or leave it, I don't really care. What I would like to see changed is the fact that there is only one path from one side of the jungle to the other.

Quote:
odd locations of brush
Honestly, other than the bottom lane bush being against the jungle instead of opposite it and the top lane 'corner' bushes being a little too small, I don't see a problem with the placement. Maybe add a bush or two in Vilemaw's hidey-hole?

Quote:
the "lane like" layout of the jungle and locations of camps.
Same as the final point of my speed shrine comment - change the single path between sides to two.

Quote:
the ease of the camps and the gold given
<snip>
I think this was a great change, to be honest. It makes both a dedicated jungler and the concept of rotating jungle much more viable than in the old TT, giving it more resemblance to SR.


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Galgus

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Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by KotlettDrake View Post
0 snowball, altars, dominion items, more starting gold, no lane phase? sounds like dominion to me
Are you claiming that this map doesn't snowball, or that there are no snowball items?

Regardless, the flow of game-play is so completely different from Dominion's that anyone who has played a handful of Dominion games should see it.


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Treetop69

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
0 snowball,
aint the biggest complaint right now that it snowballs too hard?
Quote:
altars
a statement with no argument behind them, you are equating altar that give you TF passive to dom points mandatory to kill the enemy nexus

Quote:
dominion items
nope. just TT items meant to fix some imbalances in champs. not saying they did it well, but that was the intent.

Quote:
more starting gold
and?
Quote:
no lane phase?
i dunno bout you, but in my last game i disticly remember laning vs singed as jayce

Quote:
sounds like dominion to me
Not to me.


According to you ARAM is also like dominion. No lane phase, more starting gold, a chaotic teamfight non stop. up. ARAM = Dominion guys. he proved it.


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Treetop69

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
I think this was a great change, to be honest. It makes both a dedicated jungler and the concept of rotating jungle much more viable than in the old TT, giving it more resemblance to SR.
The issue i have with it is during my game when i was laning vs singed neighter side had any dedicated jungler. He would go take his sides jungle and when i saw this i would go do mine to copy him and keep up. I got way more gold farming jungle every 30 sec than farming minions.