3's Plat Player Opinion on New TT (Wall of Text)

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CapitalLlama

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Senior Member

10-26-2012

Here is a simple evaluation of an upper level player (atleast for 3's)

What I consider flaws
Wards - They are gone...I can see why Riot made this change, never expect a gank, and since it is easier to gank, there are a lot more. However, this causes a passivity in the gameplay the more used to the map you get. I consistently find myself saying "There are no wards, I'm pushed to mid, and someone is missing. Time to run back to tower and sit there or go and try to do something at bot/altars" In old 3's, I would push to tower and be able to get around bot's wards and gank them still. It allowed for a much more satisfying gameplay instead of living in a constant fear. Because lets face it, you can't really escape a decent gank on TT.

Vilemaw - I like the fight a lot more than dragon, and the buff is nice. However the main issue I have is that it is a hard fight unless you either have the blade of the ruined king or the spectral lantern. If you have any of those, then you can take it extremely early, too early for how hard it is supposed to be (judging from the strength of the buff). For example, Shaco can take it at lvl 6-7 with lantern and lifesteal and smite. Due to how early you can get it, it forces 1 of 2 things, (1) Ward it, but there are no wards. (2) Constantly force top to check it. This might not seem like much, but if top spends the 5-10 seconds checking it every 30s-1m then bot will get ganked ridiculously more, their altars taken, etc.

Items - Riot tried to add items to "even the playing field" between bruisers and other types of champs. However, the current items just widened the gap. They gave items that allowed for greater tankyness while also costing less such as Overlord's Bloodmail. They also added the first AD caster item (ad + hp +arp + cdr + spell vamp), this solely benefits bruisers. No other champ type would get nearly the same amount of use out of it. Also, they added an item called "Blackfire torch" which basically gives Brand's passive. This also only helps AP bruisers. Normal AP nukers will blow all their abilities at once, which disallows the DOT to actually happen. However, Bruisers will often space out abilities a little bit which allows for the tick damage to actually happen.
Side note about Blackfire Torch - It procs with singed poison. Fix this ASAP. Its ludicrously broken.

Altars - These are just plain a bad idea, or at least need a massive amount of tweaking. If you get ahead, you can permanently hold both of them. This means that you are effectively getting 20-40% more gold than the other team while also being 10% stronger. It allows for insane snowballing.

Jungle - The jungle is just plain too weak also it is laid out poorly. First, its too weak because it gives a significantly more gold per monster than minions while also only being slightly stronger. In my opinion, just buff the monsters by approx 8-15%. Secondly, it is poorly laid out. It is all centralized to where the enemy has to go through to gank. It consistently causes accident-spottings of ganks. It takes out the "skill" required to ward or to place yourself correctly to not get ganked. They need to spread out the jungle more and not have it centralized to the center.
I know they put it in the center to cause more action, but it only prevents action early game and it doesn't make a difference mid/late.

Too Much "Neutral" - There is just too many neutral objectives. You have to consistently be running around trying to do neutral objectives instead of focusing on the best way to put the enemy behind/yourself ahead. The amount of neutral objectives caused the mindset to go from "Lane Gank Jungle Gank Lane" to "Lane Jungle Fear Altar Lane Check-Spider Jungle Gank"

My opinion of the problems that the new TT is facing. Its somewhat immense. It still has a lot of potential but it obviously has a lot of work to finish up in beta.

Thanks for your time!

tl;dr Read the bolded words.


Personal Plea: Bring back the Old TT and keep the new TT as a new map. They are completely different types of games. We could have double the fun!

Original Thread in General: http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2728156

Edit:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaalgamesh View Post
Let me just pile on here:

OP mentions the way this map favors hyper aggressive play and snowballing. This favors "all in" compositions, and "poke" compositions have a prayer. Carry/support doesn't work. Bruiser/bruiser/carry doesn't work. The last Twisted Treeline was fun because there isn't a "meta" to conform to like on SR or the new TT. You could play just about any style of champion or composition, so games were more varied. No "bot lane got crushed. Fed carry gg". No defined roles for lanes.

I started playing 3s only after the Janna skin was announced. I hadn't played ranked but the attraction was that the overall number of consecutive wins necessary was lower. I work way over 40 hours a week and my friends are all employed in different fields. When we heard we had another couple weeks before season 3 we changed our plans to be done by the end of this week so we didn't have to cut into sleep schedules. Now I'm afraid I'll never advance to gold from 1410 because I need two more wins (most likely) and there's no semblance of balance or comebacks. Teams are just OP vs OP. No amount of bans could save me from the amount of champs that snowball from lvl 1 and benefit too greatly from the new items.

Any team on last weeks TT could be countered by bans, items, champions, gameplay or some combination. Now it's a foregone conclusion after first blood and double altar. That's NOT dynamic, action-packed play.

tl;dr: The item and map changes favor exactly one flavor of team, restricting gameplay. Also, there are inadequate means to counter team compositions due to the insane power offered by a first blood and the new items.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VIOLENTxSHINOBI View Post
+1 would read again.

To add a bit to that...

I feel as though they have simply created a new set of problems rather than addressing the old map and the problems on that one.

There were months upon months of threads that highlighted the major issues the players had with TT, and they were most often pointed to as kiting minions into fountains, OP Singed (well, mostly all bruisers) and random jungle spawn. There was also the issue of the laser shooting twice as far on one side vs. the other. If Riot had simply fixed these 4 things, TT would have been perfect. It would have been everything it was supposed to be when first released.

The absolute refusal on Riot's part to accept the criticism and adjust accordingly is astounding here. It absolutely blows my mind how unwilling Riot is to listen to the majority of players who have clearly stated their dislike of this new map and our desire to have the old one back, with all of its "flaws". I understand that they put a few months worth of work in here and probably thousands of man hours, but that is no excuse for pushing a product into us we don't want. Riot seems to cling to the few posts praising the new map while completely discounting any and all complaints and concerns, be they rage, QQ or calm well worded questions.

And lastly, since I know someone here will come by and say "YOU AR ENOT THE MAJORITY BLAH BLAH BLAH RAAAAAAAGE" the fact is yes, the majority of posts and votes in this forum show that most players are not happy with this new map and would prefer the old one back. So please, save it for someone who will be fooled.


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Twilight Monkey

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Bump

Great point.


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Sir Andyx

Junior Member

10-26-2012

i dont know if is 3vs3 dominion or twisted treeline... give us back the old map


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copeman

Senior Member

10-26-2012

I want the old map back. I dont care if they are trying to get more players on 3v3 they are losing players now,


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VIOLENTxSHINOBI

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Senior Member

10-26-2012

+1 would read again.

To add a bit to that...

I feel as though they have simply created a new set of problems rather than addressing the old map and the problems on that one.

There were months upon months of threads that highlighted the major issues the players had with TT, and they were most often pointed to as kiting minions into fountains, OP Singed (well, mostly all bruisers) and random jungle spawn. There was also the issue of the laser shooting twice as far on one side vs. the other. If Riot had simply fixed these 4 things, TT would have been perfect. It would have been everything it was supposed to be when first released.

The absolute refusal on Riot's part to accept the criticism and adjust accordingly is astounding here. It absolutely blows my mind how unwilling Riot is to listen to the majority of players who have clearly stated their dislike of this new map and our desire to have the old one back, with all of its "flaws". I understand that they put a few months worth of work in here and probably thousands of man hours, but that is no excuse for pushing a product into us we don't want. Riot seems to cling to the few posts praising the new map while completely discounting any and all complaints and concerns, be they rage, QQ or calm well worded questions.

And lastly, since I know someone here will come by and say "YOU AR ENOT THE MAJORITY BLAH BLAH BLAH RAAAAAAAGE" the fact is yes, the majority of posts and votes in this forum show that most players are not happy with this new map and would prefer the old one back. So please, save it for someone who will be fooled.


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CapitalLlama

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by copeman View Post
I want the old map back. I dont care if they are trying to get more players on 3v3 they are losing players now,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Andyx View Post
i dont know if is 3vs3 dominion or twisted treeline... give us back the old map
Both of these....


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puchu

Junior Member

10-26-2012

I don't see why the old version cant be left in the game and just add the new map. If anything just put the old version in custom games.


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fiddlesticksssss

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by VIOLENTxSHINOBI View Post
+1 would read again.

To add a bit to that...

I feel as though they have simply created a new set of problems rather than addressing the old map and the problems on that one.

There were months upon months of threads that highlighted the major issues the players had with TT, and they were most often pointed to as kiting minions into fountains, OP Singed (well, mostly all bruisers) and random jungle spawn. There was also the issue of the laser shooting twice as far on one side vs. the other. If Riot had simply fixed these 4 things, TT would have been perfect. It would have been everything it was supposed to be when first released.

The absolute refusal on Riot's part to accept the criticism and adjust accordingly is astounding here. It absolutely blows my mind how unwilling Riot is to listen to the majority of players who have clearly stated their dislike of this new map and our desire to have the old one back, with all of its "flaws". I understand that they put a few months worth of work in here and probably thousands of man hours, but that is no excuse for pushing a product into us we don't want. Riot seems to cling to the few posts praising the new map while completely discounting any and all complaints and concerns, be they rage, QQ or calm well worded questions.

And lastly, since I know someone here will come by and say "YOU AR ENOT THE MAJORITY BLAH BLAH BLAH RAAAAAAAGE" the fact is yes, the majority of posts and votes in this forum show that most players are not happy with this new map and would prefer the old one back. So please, save it for someone who will be fooled.
Someone must be blackmailing them. Riot needs to blink twice if this is true.


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Strixie

Member

10-26-2012

I used to be an avid 3's player, guess I have to hunker down and pick one of the SR meta rolls. I just want to play the game the way it was designed and 3's was a great way to do that without the drama of SR. Now SR is all thats left. I thought dominion was a wakeup call that we don't want any other type of gameplay. Guess not, oh well.


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CapitalLlama

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by VIOLENTxSHINOBI View Post
+1 would read again.

To add a bit to that...

I feel as though they have simply created a new set of problems rather than addressing the old map and the problems on that one.

There were months upon months of threads that highlighted the major issues the players had with TT, and they were most often pointed to as kiting minions into fountains, OP Singed (well, mostly all bruisers) and random jungle spawn. There was also the issue of the laser shooting twice as far on one side vs. the other. If Riot had simply fixed these 4 things, TT would have been perfect. It would have been everything it was supposed to be when first released.

The absolute refusal on Riot's part to accept the criticism and adjust accordingly is astounding here. It absolutely blows my mind how unwilling Riot is to listen to the majority of players who have clearly stated their dislike of this new map and our desire to have the old one back, with all of its "flaws". I understand that they put a few months worth of work in here and probably thousands of man hours, but that is no excuse for pushing a product into us we don't want. Riot seems to cling to the few posts praising the new map while completely discounting any and all complaints and concerns, be they rage, QQ or calm well worded questions.

And lastly, since I know someone here will come by and say "YOU AR ENOT THE MAJORITY BLAH BLAH BLAH RAAAAAAAGE" the fact is yes, the majority of posts and votes in this forum show that most players are not happy with this new map and would prefer the old one back. So please, save it for someone who will be fooled.
Added to OP


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