@Riot: I am concerned by the QQ threads, and would like to offer possible solutions!

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Tortferngatr

Senior Member

10-24-2012

First of all: I REALLY like a lot of the work you guys have done. I'm not on PBE, but the map looks AMAZING! I certainly like how it looks.

That being said, I have noticed a VERY large number of kneejerk QQ threads, and I have seemed to garner the following complaints from the muck:

1. People dislike the replacement of buffs with capture points/the speed shrine. It was previously a shorter, faster, more player-specific SR; many people are annoyed by the sudden feeling that Dominion's been injected into TT. I love Dominion and so do many people who prefer old Treeline to new Treeline, but I like TT for different reasons than I do Dominion--it's slower-paced but tends to go faster than SR, it feels more intimate and less stagnant, but it maintains many of the things that make SR fun without many of its weaknesses.

2. The jungle seems boring and smaller, especially with the speed shrine. Moving around a triangle isn't fun

3. Removal of the upper jungle and reduction in buff variety.

4. Replacement of wards with Sweeper/Glantern; this appears to be seen as a negative because wards are ultimately a bit more strategic. I personally dislike the changes to Hextech Sweeper as a Dominion player, namely because of its strategic value as an earlygame AP item.

4.5 Teemo Shrooms+Sweeper=Wards on maps that aren't balanced around having wards. I would personally enjoy making shrooms not apply Sweeper at all, much as Cassiopeia's E only applies reduced Rylai's slow despite being single-target.

5. Riot isn't keeping old TT for people who don't like the changes--even as a custom map '~'.

6. Cheesecake items--wasn't DFG reworked (before build path changes; I mean REALLY early on) a long time ago because its old effect (similar to current Torch) was OP on some champions and UP on others?

7. Nexus wall has the unfortunate side-effect of making Blitzcrank grabs fatal at spawn, and blink users able to make perfect getaways.

8. Champion balance is still wonky. This is tied to #6.

Now let's look at the PROS:

1. It fixes several problems, like randomized jungle, creep-baiting, Wiggle's Lantern, and easy-peasy Ebonmaw.

2. EXCELLENT production values compared to old TT. The amount of work put into the new map is astounding!

3. The items, when they are not cheesecake, actually look pretty neat. I certainly look forward to playing Karthus with Witchcap and Torch (even though Torch is OP on DoT champs, it looks so fun!) along with Kha-van-Damm-pillage-Zix.

This might be a bit late, but in the hope Riot will listen and give enlightening commentary, I will attempt to offer my opinions on how to preserve the good and fix the bad:


1, 2, 3, and 4. Make the jungle SLIGHTLY more claustrophobic and branching, and add two Teal Buff possessed golems. These would give mana regen and ability power to the killer and activate the altar for its killer's team upon death, rather than the current, more Dominion-esque mechanic. This would allow you to reduce Soulsight Lantern/Glantern's active to 6 seconds again, and give Hextech Sweeper 40 AP again+the 6 second dust effect again.

You could also add a small path system BEHIND/beneath Vilemaw's lair that leads to some other buff and normal camps as a small "top jungle", which sounds like fun for the modelers (sincere fun) if you ask me. A Rabid Wolf gnawing on the bones of Vilemaw's victims? A Ghast picking up bones and cryptically observing them? Skeleton warriors? The soul of Keiran Darkwill? Ebonmaw's ghost? A sentient barn? The possibilities are many and fun!

Additionally, can we please have Grez back where the current Speed Shrine is? Even as a ghost? It DOES seem that we've grown attached to him when new TT got announced :P.

4.5: REMOVE TEEMO'S SHROOM/SWEEPER INTERACTIONS! Seriously, even if it's only a matter of principle!

5. The answer is self-evident. Can we please have old TT available in custom games? It would be highly appreciated!

6, 7, and 8. I leave these up to Riot's balance team, although I note that an elegant solution to the nexus wall problem might be to make a special wall type that prevents blinks or displacements affecting targets on the other side of the wall or moving units to the other side of the wall. It could also be used to fix up Kassadin on Dominion by reducing the amount of sheer artificial mobility he can obtain.

Finally, I would personally recommend delaying the release of new TT. Once this map comes out, its mechanics will be set in stone. I would not want to see TT go over the point of no return, particularly when I don't find SR entertaining at all.

That being said, I sincerely applaud you for the pros of what you, Rioters, have done for us in this update and sincerely hope you all at least comment on the problems/my possible solutions.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

RubenPanzerfaust

Senior Member

10-24-2012

Well written