Nocturne is not a true assassin

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Gaara 0fThe Funk

Senior Member

10-11-2012

To the OP, There are two types of assassins.
1) The kind that are tough to kill but get on a target easily and can keep on it. These are heroes like Malphite, Nocturne, Irelia, Wukong
2) The burst kind of assassin. They're usually pretty squishy but have alot more burst damage to make up for it. Such as Eve, Akali, Talon, and Kat

Both types of assassins are good, but the thing about tanky assassins is that they're more consistent and less hit or miss, although when a burst assassin gets the stars to align they win a teamfight quickly.


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Fox P McCloud

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Senior Member

10-11-2012

I dunno why this guy got downvoted--it's true.

Riot uses the assassin tag ultra-liberally...in reality, LoL really only has two assassins (pure assassin): LeBlanc and Talon---all the others are either bruisers with assassin like characteristics....Akali almost fits in the assassin category, but she's too much of a bruiser (and carry), IMO to be classified as a full assassin).

The ability to stick to and stay stuck to your target is not an assassin characteristic--it's that of a tank or bruiser.


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Tio Shadow

Member

10-11-2012

I'm having issues with this "assassin" status lately, probably due to inexperience, can someone help me out pls? xD

Why are some bruisers capable of instagibbing people better than assassins (while still being tanky)? Xin Zhao or Rengar for example can burst people ridiculously fast and still be really hard to kill... how do I counter that with a "true" assassin? D:

I had a match recently playing with Kat against a team with a Xin Zhao... both of us got really fed (about 20 kills each), but while I could dish a lot of damage and clean up in teamfights, he was an unstoppable monster that could instagib almost anyone in my team (even with some armor) and actually walked alone against the 5 of us once and managed to kill 1-2 people before we put him down (and he actually dropped our tank first).

When playing Nocturne though, I usually can't really jump on carries or do "assassinate" business... while I can gank nicely on the laning phase, I get a little lost in late game teamfights because I don't know what I should be doing. o_O

I think most players build him tanky because he got too nerfed to be viable with a full dps build, but I'm not sure.


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Broodyr

Senior Member

10-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samdrows View Post
I see a few problems with Nocturne at the moment.

1) His early/mid game are pretty solid, but at late game he falls off pretty hard.

2) One reason he falls off is that you can't build him straight up damage items; he has to build tanky because of how innately squishy he is.

3) Being tanky, late game his damage from just a Frozen Mallet is not going to be enough to take down a fully built ADC. His assassination abilities are void.

4) In this meta, most junglers become a secondary support. Nocturne being an assassin has no true "team support" skills. His ult has its blind affect, but it's not going to be used to save allies.

5) Being a "Wriggles" jungler rather than a "GP5" jungler, also contributes to his terrible scaling and how in this meta he just doesn't fit in.

6) He's another jungler if he has a bad early game, he becomes useless the rest of it.
I often find my late game with him is perfectly fine; better than some other assassins. I do build him nearly full damage, and still go fine with him (Wriggle's, FM, Bloodthirster, even 'Zerkers for more deeps and passive procs, but usually throw in a GA as a third or fourth item). It's not too uncommon for me to go something like 16-6 with him. He's definitely squishier than other junglers, but I find if you play him properly, and don't just jump in, he can do some serious damage. And as you said, he has a fairly good early game, so it's unlikely to get behind, and if you do, it's always possible to catch up.


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Wise Squirrel

Senior Member

10-11-2012

Assassins have a kit that kill a specific target instead of focusing on aoe or sustained damage.

Whether he escapes or not does not dictate whether the target lives or dies.

Or are you talking about Escape Artists?


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Shacô Bot

Senior Member

10-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mogs01gt View Post
Its all about his ganks, that is why he has been nerfed soo much.
his level one ult is actually more restricting on gank range than a shaco Q, I don't see what the fuss is about.


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Shacô Bot

Senior Member

10-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Griftrix View Post
Hey. I do not mean to be glib in saying this, but can you please tell us what you think an assassin in LoL means? It should help us focus the discussion.
Shaco imo defines assassin.


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1st HanarSpectre

Senior Member

10-11-2012

Nocturne is an assassin, if you build pure damage on him, he can kill any squishy within his fear duration.
People build him tanky because a tanky initiator/disruptor who still does acceptable damage is usually better for a team than a squishy melee assassin.


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Seronys

Member

10-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Synnister View Post
People play Nocturne (incorrectly might I add) as a bruiser. Hell... I've even seen him played as a tank.

Not a fault of the champ. A fault of how people play the champ.

Furthermore, you, and most others around here, have no clue as to what constitutes an assassin.

Hint: high burst damage has little to nothing to do with it.

i suppose you want us to build zerker greaves, and rush an IE on him while playing solo top as well amiright? xD


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Wise Squirrel

Senior Member

10-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shac Bot View Post
his level one ult is actually more restricting on gank range than a shaco Q, I don't see what the fuss is about.
Did you play release nocturne?

That sexy lvl 1 semi global range, I miss it.