Item Concept Trash Bin

Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

TealNinje

Senior Member

10-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
Just give people a chance...
Do a search for "Magic Thornmail." This is not a new idea. It wasn't new 2 years ago. It is not going to happen.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Sonic Nova

Senior Member

10-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by TealNinje View Post
Do a search for "Magic Thornmail." This is not a new idea. It wasn't new 2 years ago. It is not going to happen.
I wasn't saying it's a new idea, I mentioned that there are a lot of unoriginal ideas, the magic thornmail included. I was just trying to close my statement in a way that would cause less bias.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

TealNinje

Senior Member

10-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
I wasn't saying it's a new idea, I mentioned that there are a lot of unoriginal ideas, the magic thornmail included. I was just trying to close my statement in a way that would cause less bias.
All of the points in Ex's list are ideas that have been brought up and shot down repeatedly. He, as well as the rest of us, are sick of explaining why they're bad. So, instead you get the Trash Bin, and if your idea fits the Trash Bin, you can go search it and find out WHY it's in the Trash Bin.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

JustMyBassCannon

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChampStat View Post
Just a question, Exdeadman. Every time someone suggests a new bruiser/AD caster item, you counter it by saying that AD carries are balanced around 0 cooldown reduction. Why is that? I just don't see what's so bad about Graves firing Buckshot every 7 seconds instead of every 9. Please enlighten me.
Ranged carries in general are not balanced around having CDR available; they've been balanced to have 0% CDR. It's not just Graves' Buckshot; there's Snap Trap/90 Caliber Net, Rocket Jump/Buster Shot, Tumble/Condemn...EVERY carry has been designed without the need for CDR. They're supposed to save their spells for utility--and some of them, even make important trade offs--while focusing with their attacks for damage. If they have enough CDR to have their utility/trade off spells ready all the time (in Graves' case, it's not Buckshot but rather Quick Draw that would become broken), then they're able to abuse and overuse those abilities.

Now, yes, a few of the carries can build CDR currently. Ezreal's a hybrid, and Graves can abuse Youmuu's Ghostblade well enough. I'm pretty sure Riot has paid special attention to them and their cooldowns for that reason.



And before I respond to Sonic Nova's post, allow me to preface it with this; did your Enter key break?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
Exdeadman, I know you're attempting to handle item concepts and sorting them between the good and the bad, and you now have somewhat of a following from what I understand, but you're not the authority on item concepts. I know you appreciate balance (I appreciate balance myself), but I've so far seen you shoot down multiple item concepts or item adjustments that are entirely feasible.
A following? I don't think so. I mean, I know a few people and a few people know me, but if I have any sort of following, I'm more willing to bet that it's not a positive one, mostly due to an abrasive, sometimes arrogant personality.

As for item balance and why I like to shoot down these item concepts and adjustments, it's because I have literally seen hundreds of threads reposting the same ideas, getting shot down by other people who frequent Item Discussion. And these ideas STILL GET REPOSTED. You people act like you've never used a search engine before; there's a search bar in the top right of each forum section.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
I understand that a lot of people do want parallel items, like a magic thornmail, which is one thing I've been wanting to bring up. I still don't understand why you keep insisting it would break the game, just have it have a passive where it can't return the MD from other thornmails. This would stop it from reaching an infinitely small number of damage, as you have described as breaking the game. Riot isn't that stupid, if they wanted to implement m. thornmail they would know how to prevent it from breaking the game (if you were a parent, would you want your baby to get hurt?).
That's only the first argument of how it's mechanically broken; yes, Riot could idiot-proof the way the item works and spend extra time between each patch to make sure they don't undo any safeguards on that particular item (way too much work imo)...but then what about balance?

Think about this for a second. Someone plays their favorite carry, and they farm up their IE and then both Thornmails. You tell me right now what the **** you can do to touch that carry, outside of 5v1 which they're never going to allow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
I know many people want unoriginal, parallel items, but listing all the types of unoriginal ideas and posting them under only one thread isn't going to solve anything, and people are still going to create threads to promote the idea of parallel items. We're all players here, we don't take precedence before others, seniority does give some status, but not enough to claim, say, that you perfectly understand Riot's balance system (which only a Rioter would).
I know that at least a few people have asked (or bumped this thread) for it to be stickied to the top of the page. That would at least help with people who don't bother to use the search bar, but look to see if the first page has their idea written on it already.

And I don't claim to understand all of Riot's balance--hell, Xypherous is about to change everything we think we know about League of Legends--but I have a very solid understanding of the system. To paraphrase a genius Brit; Considering I've been playing this game for most of its lifespan, most average players will be worse than me, and that's a scary thought.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
I've seen some pretty marvelous threads started by junior members, while still seeing rather stupid ones started by senior members.
Likewise; I'm not discriminating against how much someone has posted on the forums, I merely discriminate against what they say on the forums. Sometimes it's fun to point out their level of seniority while doing that, but it's not really the focus ever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
I'm not trying to be demeaning in any way, but can you at least look past some of your bias and see an item for what it truly is and what it'd offer for League of Legends, instead of another item that you either say yes or no?
My bias is based on what I've learned about the game; it's not hatred for changing the system, it's a cold and calculated, systematic breakdown of why, with the game's current parameters, this idea would or would not work. Usually I end up saying why it doesn't work, and mostly by parroting what I've heard from other, equally reliable players (and one or two forum mods). Most of what I've learned, it was from other, smarter people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
Constructive criticism is the key to good concept development, don't just shoot down some ideas by saying "No, it's unbalanced, it'll ruin the game", at least approach it from your likes, dislikes, pros and cons of the item and then leave it open-ended so it doesn't sound like you've determined if it's a bad item or not.
I don't like loose ends when I can wrap something up. Now, if the idea is legitimately good--and I have seen almost a half-dozen good ideas in the past year--I will definitely put more than calculated disruption of or full agreement with the idea.

And if someone defends their idea, trying either to show what hole in itemization it fixes or how my argument can be used against me, I'm willing to discuss and debate. It's just I never come with one in the chamber and an empty clip.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Nova View Post
Just give people a chance...
I have. Hundreds of times. There's a search bar if you want to call me on that.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

TheLastBaron88

Senior Member

10-25-2012

"And before I respond to Sonic Nova's post, allow me to preface it with this; did your Enter key break?"
LMFAO. You, sir, deserve to have your own following.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

ChampStat

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Little bump to bring this back to the top. @Riot: Sticky pls


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Rakaydos

Senior Member

10-26-2012

What are your thoughts on an "AD Caster" item that, rather than simply giving spellvamp, gives a Lifesteal->Spellvamp ratio.

That is, a legendary tier item that has the passive of "gain spellvamp equal to half of your Lifesteal percentage"


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

JustMyBassCannon

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by JackalHalfdragon View Post
What are your thoughts on an "AD Caster" item that, rather than simply giving spellvamp, gives a Lifesteal->Spellvamp ratio.

That is, a legendary tier item that has the passive of "gain spellvamp equal to half of your Lifesteal percentage"
That's actually not too bad an idea. The only problem I can see with it is the fact that it would scale really well with Gunblade...but then again, all of that would be fixed if Riot would make Spell Vamp unique like Tenacity. As long as this item itself didn't have Lifesteal (because stat converters are best balanced if they don't innately have that stat), it could be pretty well balanced.

It could also pose a problem on ability-focused carries like Varus, but then again it's not likely to make that big of a problem; even at half of your Lifesteal being converted to Spell Vamp, that's really low unless you build way too much Lifesteal.

So, there you have it folks; a person who has gotten me to compromise on 2 points at the same time because it's a unique idea that actually sounds very balanced. Can't say I'm here to just say "all your ideas suck" any more :P


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

TheLastBaron88

Senior Member

10-28-2012

ERBRBRBRBRBRBRBR Bump.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Nea De Penserhir

Senior Member

11-06-2012

Bump for Sticky.