@Riot A serious discussion about gender. Please read

First Riot Post
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KVG NomNoms

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Who cares? Riot should make PC champions for the 2% of LoL players that are female?

What fun would nurse akali be if it wasn't sexified?

Akali in stained purple scrubs. Yes that sounds like a great ****ing skin.

Gtfo.


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KittyRawrRawr

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Tl dr


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Venom Stoneice

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rauhel View Post
Not a single male champion has a stripper skin. If I missed something, please let me know. You could have a sexy fireman or something. Itís something exclusive the female champions. Itís just one of the ways that women are treated differently.
Ruthless Pantheon.

But, I do tend to agree with you. The only thing you're missing is that Riot is working on improving in this area.


And also on your discussion of skins for female champions all being stripper skins, you could say the same for costumes in real life as well. Look at Halloween costumes. When a man dresses up as a doctor, he goes for a realistic interpretation of what a doctor looks like (with a few exceptions of course), while when a woman wants to dress as a nurse she usually finds a ****ty nursette outfit that shows off as much of her body as possible.

How much of your conversation on gender should be focused on a video, and not on real life, if my question. This is a societal thing, not a video game thing. Video games reflect the culture they are born in. Not vice-versa.


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Mindelan

Junior Member

10-06-2012

Very well stated, OP. I hope some reds take notice soon.


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Rachel

Member

10-06-2012

using the phrase "gamer girl" offends me more than the sexualized champions do ugh disgust


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Flana Scarlet

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rauhel View Post
Shizuhara and Flana Scarlet, thanks for your fantastic posts. I was starting to go to a dark place and it cheered me up.
Of course. Try not to let idiots get to you, these kinds of threads attract them in droves. I hope you can enjoy yourself for the rest of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by herdsheep View Post
I guess different opinions all around. Personally I strongly dislike the Syndra default as well - though as a typical straight male not for probably the same reasons, but just because it seems sort of random, arbitrary, and mediocre, missing the opportunity for a better skin - fortunately for me, there is the Justicar Skin - which I think would fit your criteria as well, so I'm not really seeing a huge problem there.

As for the Lux splash art, personally I don't find the new splash art at all sexualized. If that's the goal, I guess its a failure. I think it is miles and miles ahead of the old one in quality. The other one was just... really poorly drawn. Stylistically it it was boring. Quality-wise it was terrible. Clearly you view this the complete opposite of me, but you have to keep in mind that there are going to be people like me that cannot even really understand what your complaint there is. Yes - the pose is a bit freaky and probably not correct. No - artists are not perfect. I don't think it was done out of any sexist intentions though, more to try to convey depth and motion, which are... difficult to draw.

As for your request, well - I doubt they are not fulfilling it just to spite you, but more likely - they don't really understand wtf you are asking for or they don't really have a procedure for deleting champions from an account.
My problem is variety being used as a poor excuse to get away with odd (or flat out bad) deisgn. That's my fault for not expanding on my points.

I have no problem with 'sexy' champions, or skins. I don't, when it's done properly. Ahri is kickass, because *** is built into her character. That's part of who she is. Her being seductive and charming is the whole point.

But WTF is with characters like Soraka or Akali, who (old Soraka here) are basically wearing a sheet of cloth with a hole cut in the top for their head and a sash around the waist. What was the point? What is Riot even trying to say about these characters? *** was never part of their deal.

And before anyone complains, new Soraka has a lesser version of the same problem. Side boob is gone (yay!), but shes still wearing about a cloth from the stomach down. If there was a slight breeze at all the lane would get an easy look where the stars don't shine. Again, why? What was the point. Why have Syndra look decent from the front, then look like a random BDSM addict from the back? (I mentioned Zyra being a massive disappointment, wrote way too much on it to do more here. If you like, I can link you the blog post I did on it. short and sweet- Zyra has nothing about her that says "plant creature!", all thats left is randomly sexy human female.)

And, of course, there will always be disagreements, which is cool! I know people that like the new art. Like I said, it is a lot cleaner than her old one, and much brighter. But I still feel (strongly, as you can probably tell :P) that they used a horrid (and in my opinion- seriously overused) pose to convey her.

As for artists... I actually read something interesting once. The main jist was, pictures were always drawn like that, so the trend continues just because that's how its been done. Davin (I believe it was, one of the Rioters in the thread) said that Zyra's (I belive) artist was female, does that automatically disqualify it from being bad-sexy-sexist-whatever? I don't believe so, because it's easy to internalize how people around you work, and then strive to fit in with style, color, whatever. Any thoughts on that?


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L2 Sentinel

Senior Member

10-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by ep?dem?c View Post
By saying that if you aren't going to "respect" a skin of a champion or a woman because of how much skin she shows, you are a gross individual no matter your gender or who you are attracted to. A womens body is her own and she can show how much or how little of it she wants and she does not deserved to be shamed either way. If you think that a woman doesn't deserve to be respected because of how sexually active/sexualized she is, that is a whole other problem.

Now it's complete common knowledge that video games are going to appeal to the straight dudebro gaze because that is the majority of the people who are playing it. But the straight dudebro are not the only people playing the game and to completely ignore any gay men or straight woman who are playing your game in order to make straight guys feel more comfortable because they aren't secure enough about themselves that they can't handle a half naked guy on their screen because it might tarnish their masculinity somehow is absolutely ridiculous.

Furthermore, women are much much more then their bodies and it's horrible to see them constantly reduced to that, but it is so ingrained in the media and peoples heads it's just not going to change no matter how badly it should.
Please tell me where I stated sexualized women are wrong and do not deserve respect? All I did was create a list of which characters RIOT sexualized. These are fictional characters that don't have the power of choice. I didn't ask them the stop sexualizing women, only that they stop sexualizing characters because they are women. Treat both sexes equally. If you are going to create stripper cop Caitlyn, then make stripper fireman Ezreal, or stripper mailman Shen or something. Would it really be such a bad thing to have sexy men to go with the sexy women?


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Achenar

Senior Member

10-06-2012

So many people here are missing the point.

This is a fantastic article - thank you for writing it. There are a lot of articles floating around that discuss the same issue as it occurs in the graphic novel industry.

Essentially what happens here is that characters are designed for male power fantasy. In male power fantasy, the women are hyper-sexualised and the men, while they may be shirtless or muscly, are actually so to encourage the audience to have empathy with the character - not to appeal sexually to the other half of the population.

Prior to about a month ago, Riot weren't particularly GOOD at managing gender issues, but they weren't awful at it. The redesigns of Soraka and Lux (as the ones that come to mind) are an indication that things are shifting in the wrong way. Despite showing skin. Soraka was actually not particularly sexualised - she was portrayed as somewhat aloof and mostly inhuman. Lux was similar - she was the female equivalent of Ez in that, while attractive, was not sexualised. Katarina, who was always fairly sexualised, now looks ridiculous in much of her splash art. Overall as older characters have been redesigned they have become more painfully sexist, and what little variety there was (in body shape, for example) has disappeared.

No, LoL isn't the worst out there for boys' club mentality and sexist design choices - but it isn't good. As a female gamer - it's not quite enough to make me stop playing, but lately I feel more and more uncomfortable, even when playing with friends (and thus not being exposed to the sexism exhibited by many players).

It's certainly a barrier to bringing new female players into the game - when you know that you're going to be slapped in the face with passive sexism every time you go into champ select, before you even hit a troll player, it's much more appealing to go and play something else.


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Spoogee

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Senior Member

10-06-2012

Men like boobs.

Most LoL players are men.

Moar boobs please.

P.S. I proudly own Sheriff Caitlyn.


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Rachel

Member

10-06-2012

About sexy male champions, females are going to find other things attractive rather than just showing skin (this might come as a shock to men).
Rugged Garen for instance is imo one of the more sexy male champions cause he's all badass and manly. Don't need to show skin for that.