@Riot A serious discussion about gender. Please read

First Riot Post
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GaafGrohiik

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by maravilloso View Post
tldr : as long as you're good, gender doesn't matter, but 8 out of 10 girls suck.
only after 3-4 drinks.


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Daeva of Hell

Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginga View Post
Here's a small problem with your argument that males aren't sexualized...

You seem to be a bit biased towards what's sexual or what's not. I don't know what your gender is, but it's safe to say a lean muscular man is to girls what giant bigonkers is to boys.

If you are males, then it is obvious why you don't think muscles aren't sexy...because it's not supposed to be sexy to a male! That's why you excluded muscles as a sexual trait. Look at your assessment of the females all as strippers, now look at Pantheon, doesn't Pantheon look a bit much like a male stripper?


And also, Varus is hella ripped. Look at his body...

Pantheon looks like a Spartan/Roman soldier, not a male stripper.


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MathMage

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by GetOwned247 View Post
Pantheon looks like a Spartan/Roman soldier, not a male stripper.
Ruthless Pantheon, on the other hand...but the point is well taken. It's the Avengers meme pic all over again.


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Orthoclase

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Recruiter

10-07-2012

you can't completely blame Riot for this sort of thing, in my opinion. A lot of your points are valid, like the fact that there are no stripper male skins or whatever. Thing is, would a stripper male skin really cater to that many women? Would female gamers really be that much more likely to play an ugly/non-sexualized female champion? Also, you point out every single aspect of a female champion's visual design that is remotely attractive as though it is damning evidence. The fact that Fiora's "Tight outfit accentuates her ass" is enough to put her on the oversexualized list. The character you consider the epitome of what a female champion should be (Kayle) is often mistaken for a man. I'm not saying you don't raise some valid points, I would love to see more variety among female champions and Kayle is actually my favorite champion, but the way you worded that OP makes it sound like you are basically attacking all portrayals of attractive women.


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GaafGrohiik

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Orthoclase View Post
you can't completely blame Riot for this sort of thing, in my opinion. A lot of your points are valid, like the fact that there are no stripper male skins or whatever. Thing is, would a stripper male skin really cater to that many women? Would female gamers really be that much more likely to play an ugly/non-sexualized female champion? Also, you point out every single aspect of a female champion's visual design that is remotely attractive as though it is damning evidence. The fact that Fiora's "Tight outfit accentuates her ass" is enough to put her on the oversexualized list. The character you consider the epitome of what a female champion should be (Kayle) is often mistaken for a man. I'm not saying you don't raise some valid points, I would love to see more variety among female champions and Kayle is actually my favorite champion, but the way you worded that OP makes it sound like you are basically attacking all portrayals of attractive women.
This. This. This. Thank you.


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Sybil Cut

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMage View Post
Ruthless Pantheon, on the other hand...but the point is well taken. It's the Avengers meme pic all over again.
And for some reason, the OP justifies ruthless as ok. There's definitely a bias there, whether she's willing to admit it or not.


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GaafGrohiik

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginga View Post
Here's a small problem with your argument that males aren't sexualized...

You seem to be a bit biased towards what's sexual or what's not. I don't know what your gender is, but it's safe to say a lean muscular man is to girls what giant bigonkers is to boys.

If you are males, then it is obvious why you don't think muscles aren't sexy...because it's not supposed to be sexy to a male! That's why you excluded muscles as a sexual trait. Look at your assessment of the females all as strippers, now look at Pantheon, doesn't Pantheon look a bit much like a male stripper?


And also, Varus is hella ripped. Look at his body...
What about gay dudes? They deserve eye-candy as much as anyone else.


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dead robit

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMage View Post
But the prevalence of impossible waists, broken backs, boobs and butts all out of proportion with the rest of the body, and pinup poses on the default models of supposedly serious champions pisses me off.
oh unnaturally attractive features we cannot have those. im offended by unrealistic features. but hey i'm totally okay with a flying bird made of ice... like really. read my other posts im not against this threat at all i actually encourage diversity but that argument was weak..


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L2 Sentinel

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Holy **** that was a lot of well composed, extremely well thought-out points and a lot of data to back it up. I very much salute you! This is the stuff that's actually super useful for people like me in a position to help define our body types. I love this information and this amount of it because I can look and be like.. "Oh hey, I think I see where we can fill in some gaps!" You've actually saved me some work, and I owe you a coffee.
Thank you for the compliment! I tried to remain objective, but there are many areas that are a matter of opinion, but I hope I didn't fail too hard. If this is at all useful to you, then I consider it worth my time to do put it together. I love League of Legends, and I love Riot. No other game company I've ever heard of takes the time to engage it's player base like Riot does, and that's amazing. Just knowing that you guys are listening brings me satisfaction, so thank you.
There were a lot of great thing people have said in this thread that got buried rather quickly. I really wasn't expecting it to attract this much attention. But asking you to sift through every page is a monumental task, so I'll just share one of my favorite posts that really does a great job of summarizing what it's all about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ayrona View Post
No one is saying having a sexually appealing woman is bad. I don't think you quite understood the argument. The problem is the lack of diversity; the fact that as a whole men are portrayed as strong but women are portrayed as sexy, and with the same exact body.

And yeah, sexy skins sell. No one is arguing against that or saying that it is a bad thing, so your points are not relevant to the argument.
Simply, the complaint is a combination of:
a) The male counterparts of the sexy skins are professional skins
b) There are no counterparts for men where the sole purpose of the skin is fan service, which is the case for the most of the female skins.
c) All women that are portrayed as sexy have the same exact body type

I mean, it is fairly clear that the argument is that the ideals for genders are extremely different and that it makes many people uncomfortable. No one is arguing that sexy skins are bad inherently, so why are so many people arguing against this point and completely ignoring the bigger picture? Could you all at least read the original post?

Also, what they want Riot to do about it is also pretty clear given the argument: There is not enough diversity, so it would directly follow that including more diversity in options is exactly what they want.

Mainly, what could be done about it:
a) More diversity in female champion design, like male champions have
b) Sexy skins for the men of league
c) More cool/strong skins for women

Notice how NONE of these options are saying get rid of sexy skins from the game?
I just want to express to you how much I love Diana. I don't usually buy champion on the first day of release, but I thought Diana looked amazing. Her armor was cool, her hair was neat, and her weapon just looks awesome. I also love many of the champions that I criticized. I may have pointed out that they were sexualized, but I don't always think it's inappropriate or even a bad thing. Janna is amazing and I don't want her changed. I didn't spend much time talking about all the things I really love because I didn't want it to be about my personal tastes. I get a lot of flak for saying Tryndamere and PK Olaf are not sexualized or even attractive because apparently chicks dig muscle, but I'd argue that guys dig muscle way more than women do, just not necessarily in a sexual way. There's a reason male fashion models don't look like Mr. Universe.
Anyway, I'm glad you find my post helpful. I'm glad you took the time out of your busy weekend to read it. If I had to pick one thing to come out of this thread, I'd really like a granny champion. I saw you respond to someone that you don't like haggardly old ladies, but how can you say no to this face? http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:A...gMZ9CqWIJZrlow

Also, I don't know how familiar you are with The Legend of Korra, but Lin Bei Fong is the epitome of cool.


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Rhonin Greymane

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karolina View Post
We need a champ like this !
She could be a great tank :P
Olaf's girlfriend, back from his teenage years. I did the lore for you.