Do's and Dont's of the jungle?

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0Mint0

Senior Member

09-30-2012

I'm kinda confused about a few areas of jungling, hopefully someone can help me clear this up. Most of these questions came up after watching the TheOddOne jungle Amumu, which can easily be found on youtube. If anyone with a decent elo, or knowledge of high level game play could answer I would appreciate it.

After ganking, successful or not, is it acceptable to kill a few minions?
If you are by a lane that is not occupied by the laners, can you clear the wave? (lvl 1- 10)
About when is the correct time to really leave your jungle?


I noticed that TheOddOne would push lanes in ranked 2k+ elo as a jungler even if people were in the lane farming.. that fine? I see pro's clearing lane waves while jungling but in game people rage if you push the lane.


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cpandarun

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Senior Member

10-01-2012

After a successful gank where you gave the kill to the laner taking a few minions as tax shouldn't be a big deal. Mostly it gives you some extra xp. If you got the kill just walk off and let them farm.

If you're going to clear a lane with the laner gone your goal would be to reset the wave. You would do this if your wave is pushing and the laner comes back to find the wave under the enemy tower with few creeps to pick off and in the danger of being ganked. So if you're going to clear it clear it fast. It would be good practice to help your wave push if it's already doing so but if the enemy wave is pushing let it. If the tower is going to take xp and gold I would stay around to last hit under tower.

The correct time to leave the jungle is different depending on the game. If you think your presence will change a situation to a positive outcome you should leave the jungle. If you have a clear advantage but don't come out of the jungle to take objectives towers dragon buffs ect then you're wasting that advantage. Usually after a couple towers are down that's when you should start grouping up and moving with the team taking jungle and lane creeps on the way to wherever it is you're going. Without a tower you don't only lose defense but you create a large oppurtunity for ganks in that lane and control of that part of the jungle.

Side note. If a laner starts raging at you to leave their lane just leave. It's better to lose some xp and gold that nobody will get instead of dealing with the potential fallout of some immature player.


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acosn

Senior Member

10-01-2012

You push a lane for one of two reasons-
1: Destroy the tower
2: reset the lane

With that said, some people will have **** fits over anything you do in their lane. I've literally had people ***** that I was last hitting mobs in a lane they weren't even in a position to benefit from.

There's no right time to leave the jungle. It's dependent on who you pick, and a number of other factors that generally come down to who's doing well and who's not. I've literally had games where I never really left jungle (or at least THEIR jungle) because all three lanes were just curb stomping the other team. In other situations I might gank as early as level 2 and as late as level 6.


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Etherimp

Senior Member

10-01-2012

1. Pushing a lane either resets it, does damage to the tower, and/or denies XP/Gold from the enemy team. That may be why TheOddOne did so.

2. Junglers get the least farm/XP behind Support.. If I am ganking a lane whether I get the kill or not, I will sometimes take a few minion kills or soak up a LITTLE experience if I am behind in CS/XP. As long as you just take a few last hits and don't auto-attack/aoe mobs, I don't see the problem.

3. As jungler, the jungle is your lane. Your job is to control that lane. Once towers go down and team fights start breaking out (mid game), that's usually when you "leave" the jungle. But...You should always be farming your jungle.


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Valrcrist

Senior Member

10-01-2012

To clarify what people mean by "resetting the lane", if your gank succeeds in either killing the enemy laner, or pushing him out of lane to back, then you need to take a look at the lane and determine what it's doing. If the lane is already naturally pushing, then you want to clear out the enemy creep wave entirely, so that yours will hit their tower, and they'll lose the exp/CS from that wave.

If your creep wave ISN'T already pushing towards their tower, then you probably don't want to push it, since in general, it's better for the enemy creep wave to push towards your tower, as long as you're there to freeze the lane before it hits your tower. Letting their wave push to you means that you can safely CS by your tower, and forces the opposing laner to have to choose between missing CS, or way over-extending, leaving them vulnerable to follow up ganks.

Basically, sometimes it's better to push the lane, sometimes it's better not to. You'll have to take a look at the specific conditions, and decide which is which.


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Horsicorn

Junior Member

10-01-2012

even if your gank doesn't result in a kill, i could still see why you would maybe want to push the lane. if you ganked mid and left both the friendly and enemy mids at 50% health, but the enemy mid has a lot greater burst potential, you can shove the lane so your mid can recall and not have to worry about the enemy mid taking your tower/roaming. even if your laner doesn't want to recall, if you shove top or bottom you can have the friendly(s) that were in that lane go mid with you and potentially destroy the mid tower, opening up the enemy jungle for contest. i know in big tournaments in stuff they put a lot of importance on taking down that mid tower so that might be why


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Dalek Caan

Senior Member

10-02-2012

The minions aren't your problem. If you ganked a lane and your lanemate and the enemy both died, you don't push unless the enemy wave is at your tower or you can get the turret. If both champs are at 50% health and you know your teammate is going to die, you can either cover the lane to let them bluepill or sit in the nearby brush to give off the appearance that you left. Depends on the champ here, sometimes it's better to stay since you won't interfere in time.
Sometimes over committing to a fight is the one thing a jungler can do to **** up. No point in tower diving early if you're unsure you can get the kill. Blowing one of their summoners is next best to a kill. Another thing you don't wanna do is die in a risky lane. Most solo tops fit into this situation. If the enemy top is ahead by a kill, your solo top might get screwed over.
Another thing I don't see many junglers doing is buying wards. Wriggles gives you a free ward but it's never enough. If bot lane is permanently warded, blow the money on a vision ward. Clear their ward, go kill a camp or two, and come back to gank. The money you spent on the vision ward is gained by destroying their ward and a successful gank. You also waste their money and show them not to **** with you.

EDIT: Actually, some other things I don't see from many junglers:
1) Lane ganks - In the event that their lane is warded from more than one spot and they always see you approaching, sneak in behind your lane mate and hide in the bush. Not many people ward the brush unless you have Blitz on your team or someone else who constantly camps the brush. This usually ends up in kills.
2) Warding is the most important element in this ****ing game. When you see another champ ganking your allies or their jungler setting up, be nearby to counter gank. Most people don't see this coming.
3) Counter jungling is a lot more than invading at game start. Just from playing Shyvana, setting their jungler behind greatly benefits your team. You'll have a lot more presence than their jungler and counter ganking will be a lot easier.
4) Warding. Most junglers don't do this. Unless you're playing a premade, assume your teammates are idiots. Blowing money on wards isn't a waste if it helps you see their team approaching from the side. Catching an enemy waiting in the bush sets your team ahead. You won't be waiting for either side to initiate, you'll be rushing their team since it's 4v5. I don't give a **** what role you are, BUY WARDS. Unless every bush on the map is lit up by a ward, you don't have enough wards.