Long time ezreal, got some quick questions.

12
Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Trollhammern

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Junior Member

10-01-2012

Hey guys. Like it says in the title, I've been playing Ezreal for quite a while now, and have many games under my belt. I see a lot of debate over build order though.

Many people are now saying rush an Infinity Edge over Trinity. I have read the numbers and would agree, the numbers would seem to agree that IE out paces Trinity in damage. But in all reality IE is quite pricy; 1650 for a BF sword and then another ~2k gold before it is built.

This seems like quite the investment for me, especially if I'm not getting early kills. I find a much *safer route is starting boots, and rushing a sheen (1260g). Most of my poke is with my 'q' anyway, and I find being able to poke and harass until a gank/kill is possible against ad carries/supports is definitely better than running in gung-ho right-clicking away.

I'd love to hear other people's opinions on the matter though.

Also, could someone direct me to a consistent Ezreal streamer? I've had **** for luck finding a decent one.

And lastly, my build order for Ezreal (in case there are those who are wondering) is typically as follows (with slight changes due to team comps):

1. Boots + 3 pots
2. Sheen
3. Vamp/BF sword
4. Blood Thirster
5. Phantom Dancer
6. Infinity Edge
7. Last Whisper
8. Trinity Force
9. Guardians (or w.e defensive item you need)

Obviously, Last whisper is often moved around in that list depending on what the enemy builds. Occasionally I'll even get my trinity before LW simply because they don't have enough armor for me to justify it.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Valrcrist

Senior Member

10-01-2012

Triforce provides the best midgame damage, but falls off in that role somewhat. What I mean by this is that triforce adds the most damage for any single item, but doesn't scale as well with items as more traditional ADC items do. In other words, triforce + BT + IE does less damage than IE + BT + PD.

So you want to build triforce first if you already have an early game lead and want to cement it. If you're losing, or not confident that you'll be able to press the early lead you have, then it's better to rush IE or BT. More and more pros are rushing BT as a first item it seems like, since it provides greater early game dueling power and lane sustain.

I would never rush Sheen as a first item, since it doesn't provide enough sustained damage. Most of the time you'll want to fire off your abilities as quickly as possible, rather than spacing them out, so you'll only get one sheen proc initially, then another when your abilities come off cooldown, which is 4-6s later at the earliest, depending on how many points in Q you have. Sheen also requires you to actually hit your skillshots, which you won't always necessarily be able to do. Overall, this makes Sheen much less reliable as a source of damage than other items, since, best case scenario, it adds about 20 damage every second over the course of a sustained fight. That's...not very much damage, and that's the best case scenario.

More and more what I see ez players doing is rushing phage first. Phage gives pretty decent damage and good hp, which means that you're better at duelling, and more importantly, the proc on phage is AMAZING for utility. It means that if you're winning a duel, the other person will have a much much harder time disengaging because they're slowed, and if you're losing, or need to run away from a gank or kite someone or whatever, you have the potential to do that.

After building phage, as mentioned above, you can go straight into tri-force if you're winning, or go for a straight up BT or IE if not.


(Also: a sidenote, but make sure you max W before Q, if you aren't already)


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Bravest Leader

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-01-2012

dont get sheen first, get phage. phage is broken.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Maleric

Senior Member

10-01-2012

How is Phage broken?


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Trollhammern

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Junior Member

10-01-2012

Definitely good points all around, Valrcrist. I appreciate the feedback.

Very true concerning sheen, many people seem to not get it unless they have quite the lead. However, my next few points will argue as to why I find it a better item to rush.

I play bottom lane fairly passively, poking with 'q' when needed. It is also the first ability I max out. Skill order is q-e-q-w-q-r. Until midgame, I try to avoid trading in melee range with other champions, due to the fact that other ad carries (graves, caitlyn, and mf) can usually get the upperhand regardless. (Although, maxing w would definitely open up that realm of possibilities, allowing me to trade with the upperhand). With a competent support I can typically manage to get a kill early game, and if not my farm is usually fairly good.

During my sheen phase, I can typically land a kill and/or an assist, freeing the lane for me and allowing us to either a) grab dragon or b) farm the lane without harass.

I could go on and on with this topic, but no one wants a wall of text when I can sum it up much simpler.

I believe the damage on 'q' (if you are good with the ability, and able to land the shot) along with Sheen early game gives me the upper hand early game. Especially since most of it is poking and zoning. Occasionally I am successful at zoning the other AD carry from the minions. If not, they can be wide open for a gank and/or a good initiate from my support (assuming ali/blitz/leona and similar).

Now, occasionally I will take a different route and grab that B.F. sword first, but more often than not I find my early game is stronger with a sheen.

There is a very large possibility that I am playing AD carry incorrectly when it comes to Ezreal. This is a reason I was requesting stream suggestions on popular Ezreal players. I typically do well when I play Ez, but am definitely open to suggestions that may not be rightly apparent, such as getting a BF sword and maxing 'w', giving me the upperhand with damage and lowering their output with 'w'. (Thanks valcrist).

Looking to start a debate on both sides of the spectrum here, and gain perspective.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Valrcrist

Senior Member

10-01-2012

Maxing W actually is better poke than maxing Q, even if that's your playstyle.

Q does a flat amount of bonus damage + 100% of AD + 20% of AP. The bonus AD and AP are the same amount regardless of rank, which is why maxing Q first isn't beneficial. 1 point in Q gives you 35 bonus damage, 5 points in Q gives you 115 bonus damage, and 2s off the cooldown. The reduced cooldown is nice, I'll grant you that, but you're talking about putting 5 points into a skill for 80 bonus damage. Additionally, Q is actually really hard to hit against a competent player. It's quite easy for the enemy to just leave the creep wave between the two of you, which, combined with moving around, makes landing a Q nearly impossible when talking about just general poke, as opposed to an up close all in fight.

W on the other hand does 250 damage at max rank, has a wider hitbox than Q, and most importantly, goes THROUGH targets it hits, which means that you won't accidentally hit a creep when trying to harass the enemy. The debuff also means that if the other person tries to go all in on you, you can outtrade them, all other things being equal.

Personally, it sounds like you're being fairly passive with Ez, which isn't really playing him to his full potential, but if you're more comfortable sitting back and just throwing out the occasional poke, then that's up to you. Maxing W first is STILL better at that playstyle than maxing Q though, due to the difference in damage, and the increased ease of hitting W.

As far as item build, if you aren't being aggressive, then I definitely wouldn't advocate getting a triforce first, since, as I mentioned above, triforce is all about pushing an early advantage. But again, for poking something like a BF sword is still better imo, since it builds into a better longterm item (either BT or IE) AND provides nearly the same in lane advantage, since a BF sword will add 45 damage to a Q, AND 45 damage to any auto attacks you may do. It only takes one Q + one auto attack for BF sword to be more damaging than a sheen at any level below 15.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Trollhammern

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Junior Member

10-01-2012

Valrcrist. Again, great points, really showing me the other side to Ezreal.

There are 2 main reasons I max 'q' before 'w'. I'll keep this short because I am a little bit time constrained.

1) Procs on hit abilities. This is pretty self explanatory, and works well with Sheen and Phage, if you decide to go with either item early game.

2) Mana Cost. I'm sure 'w' harass is great, but the amount of pokes you can get out with 'w' is severely limited compared to 'q'. 'W' roughly twice the mana cost, and I cannot justify getting mana regen in my runepage simply for early game poke,

Sorry for the short response, but again, time constrained.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Rezo

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

10-01-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valrcrist View Post
Triforce provides the best midgame damage, but falls off in that role somewhat. What I mean by this is that triforce adds the most damage for any single item
Don't believe thats accurate. I am still practicing EZ myself but I am reluctant to give up the TF mostly because of the phage.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Valrcrist

Senior Member

10-01-2012

Quote:
1) Procs on hit abilities. This is pretty self explanatory, and works well with Sheen and Phage, if you decide to go with either item early game.
But Q will proc on-hit abilities regardless of whether you take 1 point in it or 5. The point I'm trying to make isn't that you shouldn't take it at all, just that it's not worth maxing out first given how little additional benefit you get out of it for each extra point.

Quote:
2) Mana Cost. I'm sure 'w' harass is great, but the amount of pokes you can get out with 'w' is severely limited compared to 'q'. 'W' roughly twice the mana cost, and I cannot justify getting mana regen in my runepage simply for early game poke,
Max rank W is actually just about as mana efficient as max rank Q. Max rank W costs 90 mana for 250 damage, max rank Q costs 40 mana for 115 damage (again, ranking up Q only decreases the cooldown and increases the flat bonus damage, it doesn't increase the AD/AP ratios.) This means that on W costs 2.25x as much mana as one Q, and does about 2.2x as much damage. Given how much easier landing a W is, and the utility of the attack speed reduction, I find that tradeoff to be definitely worth it.


Quote:
Don't believe thats accurate. I am still practicing EZ myself but I am reluctant to give up the TF mostly because of the phage
Phage just by itself is incredibly cost efficient. There's nothing stopping you from buying a phage as one of your first items and then going BT/IE from there rather than finishing a triforce.


Comment below rating threshold, click here to show it.

Zionova

Senior Member

10-01-2012

If I am in the lead early I will farm til I get a BF sword. I tend to play very aggressive, and often have Taric/any other support that can stun so the extra AD on my Q and AA is very important. Then I build Phage, finish IE, finish Triforce, then either LW or BT depending on enemy builds. My core for Ezreal is IE/Triforce/LW and at that point I can easily duel most people 1v1 or 1v2. Full build for me is usually IE/Triforce/LW/BT/GA with zerkers greaves. I often get to the point where I am beginning to get double-triple kills every team fight and can solo everything but baron in less than 10 seconds.


12