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### Noob Question Regarding AS Vayne

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Simiun

Junior Member

Hey guys. I have been playing LoL for a month or so and had an attack speed question regarding Vayne. I want to try to reach the AS cap in game and have a few questions about it.

I am currently a level 22 summoner and wanted to try this before I start playing ranked games. Mainly just for fun, but I am also curious how viable it is and am wondering if anyone has already tried it.

Basically, I ran some numbers and this is what I came up with (I am by no means a math expert, my math is very simplistic, so feel free to let me know what I am missing here). Also I am not looking to be 100% exact with these numbers. Just something close.

Vayne's base AS is 0.658. Now if we just look purely at percentages, you would need roughly an extra 380% to reach the 2.5 attacks per second cap.

Vayne gains 3.1% AS per level which equals an extra 52.7% @ level 18.
Vayne can gain up to 42% AS from runes/masteries.
Itemization: Berserker's + Stinger + 4 Phantom Dancers = 285% AS.
285 + 42 + 52.7 = 379.7% AS at level 18.

Now that I have layed all that out, here are my questions:

1) Is my math at least somewhat correct or close to it? Lol.

2) Assuming my math and itemization is correct, has anyone ever tried this? Was it fun?

3) Is this even somewhat viable? I know someone will probably tell me that this is way to much AS and you're probably right. Throwing in a BT or Edge or Black Cleaver would probably make me pwn a lot harder. But I really just wanna know if I could wreck some face in my level 22, solo queue, non-ranked games with this build.

Any help and correction on this topic would be much appreciated!

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Warrrrax

Senior Member

Your math looks fine.

Im sure people have tried it to some extend. Stacking AS that is.

It isn't really all that viable, mostly because Vayne definitely needs some sustain for early game, and she needs some AD to last hit and harass. Simply put, during laning its very difficult to get in multiple shots and you tend to tumble in, get a shot off and move back. Even during teamfights, etc she tends to shoot and scoot. Tumble in, shoot once or twice, tumble to the side move back, pop ult to stealth, etc. She keeps moving and uses her tumble and knockback. Even when chasing she gets in 1 shot periodically and AS is irrelevant mostly, exceot for faster attk animation.

This type of playstyle lends itself to having lots of AD and crit, and less AS. Silver bolts just isnt enough DPS gain to try to optimize based on AS. Even KOG MAW tends to build AD instead of AS and at level 9 he is adding 120 onhit dmg vs a 2k foe! Thats a crapton of damage, not true dmg, but still.

4 PDs would be 120% crit which is hugely wasteful and the movespeed woulod ahve huuuge diminishing returns.

Instead of this approach maybe try a more moderate one... get your 2 Dorans Blades, vamp scepter, and maybe 1 PD first instead of BFSword/IE. Then the IE followed by 1 more PD, which gets you to 85% crit. Youd then upgrade vamp scepter to executioners blade for maxed crit, high lifesteal without needing bloodthirster.

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Owl Be Back

Senior Member

I've tried it, and it's fun as heck.

it's also SLIGHTLY viable.

I wouldn't do it in ranked, but you can get away with it in normals.

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Simiun

Junior Member

Thanks Warrrrax. You make some really good points. I didn't think much of the play style of Vayne when putting this together. She is really more of a poker than a machine gunner, lol. Which I'm guessing is why most people stack so much AD with her.

Honestly, before coming up with this build, I did have my own build that I was doing (and still am). Granted, I lane with my wife every single game, and she plays a really solid tanky Amumu who gives me all the LHs and kills so I am fed pretty fast (and don't need much life steal because she tanks well and I play safe).

I usually start with the Boots of Swiftness for some early chase downs and then rush PD. The reason I rush PD is because in solo queue at my level I find it hard to get kills once we start having some team fights around mid game. No one seems to understand the concept that the ADC needs kills for the long haul, lol. I find that the extra AS gets me a few free kills simply cause I am attacking faster. After PD I grab a Black Cleaver and then Blood Thirster > Infinity Edge.

Do you think that combo that you recommended, Dorans x2 > Vamp Scepter > PD > IE > PD > Executioners, would be better than what I was doing?

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Simiun

Junior Member

Quote:
Cardboardowl:
I've tried it, and it's fun as heck.

it's also SLIGHTLY viable.

I wouldn't do it in ranked, but you can get away with it in normals.

Lol. Thanks for the reply man. Glad to hear it is fun. That was what I figured. Fun as **** in normals but not for ranked.

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kenoin

Member

Yeah, [ viable, as previously stated not in ranked though ] But lets hope your bottom lane that your facing is stupid or else you're going to have a very hard time trying to make this work. Best rearguards, kenoin.

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Sereg Anfaug

Senior Member

While Vayne does benefit from AS moreso then other ADCs, that doesn't mean you should stack it at the expense of everything else.

Rather, work a little bit more if it into your build then you would with a standard carry. As I don't play Vayne, I can't offer anything more specific then that, but I have played on teams with Vaynes that have gone all out on attack speed, and they were totally unable to play their role. Don't do that, please.

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AdNauseum

Junior Member

Your calculation for attack speed is missing the base multiplier...so you only need 280% aspd from items, masteries and runes total.

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Warrrrax

Senior Member

Quote:
Simiun:
Thanks Warrrrax. Do you think that combo that you recommended, Dorans x2 > Vamp Scepter > PD > IE > PD > Executioners, would be better than what I was doing?

I am not an expert at her, so I can't really vouch for its effectiveness beyond theorycrafting. Did you check Solomid for guides? Im pretty sure they will say the same kind of thing though. Many will rush BFSword to IE in line with her big poke aspect (after a few dorans and possibly a vamp scepter if more sustain is needed or even a wriggles).

I think that is the most effective. But I believe a PD first is doable and fits your concept a lot better. Youd get even more manueverability plus a much better chance at getting your Silver Bolt damage (and applying Ult AD dmg faster). But you really do need some lifesteal and some extra health and some AD for early on laning.

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Eledhan

Senior Member

Quote:
Warrrrax:
I think that is the most effective. But I believe a PD first is doable and fits your concept a lot better. Youd get even more manueverability plus a much better chance at getting your Silver Bolt damage (and applying Ult AD dmg faster). But you really do need some lifesteal and some extra health and some AD for early on laning.

Yeah, pretty much this. Unfortunately, this concept primarily works onKog'Maw, though. Every other ADC (including Vayne) really should be looking for more raw AD or crit damage (meaning Bloodthirster or Infinity Edge) to scale up better. Because Vayne's AS scaling proc requires multiple "procs" to actually trigger, she doesn't get the same level of benefits out of AS like Kog does.

However, rushing a Zeal after 2 Dblades isn't BAD, necessarily, on Vayne, you just are probably better served by getting more AD, since her other two spells scale on that and not on AS. M5's Genja (ADC) is a consistent user of the 2 Dblades & Zeal rush for the mobility and AS it provides, so I guess there are merits to it regardless of champion.

TL/DR - Player preference. If you like the high AS/MS from Zeal/PD, then rush that after you get some dblades. Otherwise, build Vayne similar to the other raw AD scaling ADC's like Graves.